Dentology Podcast with Kirsty & Jim Hague

Transcript – Dentology Podcast with Kirsty & Jim Hague

Episode Release Date – Monday 20 January 2025

Chris (00:01.478)
Well, we are here again. We’ve burst through the hundred and seventy something counter. We’re heading towards 180 episodes of Dentology. Can you believe that? People have listened to us for maybe nearly 180 hours. I think that’s lovely. And also maybe Sado. I think that when you actually boil down how much talking we do, that actually I think they listen to our guests. It’s our guests that join me. That’s very true. I think they love this little bit of the beginning. Oh really?

I think there’s some people signing for it. They all tuned in for the 30 seconds. Little banter. Well now that they’ve had what they wanted, we should introduce our guests. The proper people. We are, exactly. So today we have the founders of Hague Dental, the end-to-end solutions provider of design, refurbishment, equipment and equipment servicing. We have Kirsty Hague, Interior Director and Jim Hague, the Sales Director. Welcome to you both. How are you?

Kirsty Hague (00:54.54)
Hello.

Chris (00:55.662)
Hello, hello, hello. observant listeners, they would have recognized a commonality of surname. Yeah. And also husband and wife. And do you reckon that might be how the name of the business came around? Well, Hey Dental, possibly. Yeah, look at that. Woohoo! But there’s a funny thing in Frank Taylor and Associates, and Chris has it as well, the amount of people that say to us, you founded Frank Taylor and Associates, you’re one of the founders. And it’s like, if we did, we probably wouldn’t have called it Frank Taylor.

Kirsty Hague (01:02.414)
F.

Chris (01:24.965)
and associates, it would have probably been something that would have related to us. yeah. As opposed to a lot of people think that we founded a business. We didn’t. Yeah, we bought it 25 years from Frank Taylor. There was a Frank Taylor. So anyway, how you both doing? Are you well?

Kirsty Hague (01:25.157)
Thank

Kirsty Hague (01:32.91)
.

Kirsty Hague (01:39.982)
Yeah, took nine teenagers to Spain.

Chris (01:42.149)
Pleased to hear it.

Chris (01:47.033)
Yeah. Yeah. Back from Spain. Did you go to Spain over Christmas?

Chris (01:53.517)
Whoa. Blimey, that sounds like a school trip.

Flipping it. They will have to hold hands like in a crocodile, know, when you go out. you don’t lose your kids. Talking of the family thing, let’s start at the beginning. Give us a sense of your upbringing, your family structure, your family tree, what that looks like. We’ll get to the dentistry bit in a minute, but it’s nice to know who we’re talking to.

Kirsty Hague (02:17.87)
If I could start then, yeah, I mean, my father was from Yorkshire, mother’s from East London. Originally I grew up in Amsterdam. So actually English is my second language. Not a lot of people. So the name Hague has come from Holland, Haag, originally, but I’m talking 400 years ago. So I was over there because my father was in business there.

Chris (02:24.9)
system beings.

Chris (02:31.322)
Chris (02:40.197)
I don’t know why.

Kirsty Hague (02:45.634)
then came back to England, a little bit of time in East London and then down near Portsmouth. It’s called Petersfield in Hampshire. So grew up there for 10 years, of a junior and senior school. Then I, after leaving school, worked many different things, sort of like motors, construction industry.

Chris (02:54.104)
well.

Kirsty Hague (03:13.774)
the Sea Life Centre down in Portsmouth, which was, really enjoyed that job. Then I decided to go and do a degree in civil engineering. And during that course, I decided to come back and help set up a kids holiday camp at my old school, senior school, which is where I met the delightful Kirsty.

Chris (03:33.167)
I will.

Chris (03:36.741)
Nice segue, well done. yeah. Please don’t tell me she’s one of the students in year 11 or something.

Kirsty Hague (03:39.758)
.

Kirsty Hague (03:43.246)
Yes, no, there were quite little kids, we met looking after kids but my background was slightly different in fact I was born in Hong Kong and I moved here with just my mum and my parents divorced and then I grew up in Peterstow the same time as him and that’s when I met him basically yeah just through

through the kids club really. But my background was always art and psychology. So I started out when I first left university, basically working in mental health as an art therapist, but having been to art college and yeah, did various things until I stepped into working with Jim after we had our fourth child. So we’ve four lovely kids from 17 to 24.

And that’s what we do, really.

Chris (04:37.667)
Interesting commonality that the fact that you came from Amsterdam to the UK and you came from Hong Kong Hmm. It’s interesting one. I said about you know, how many people? Couples of that I know anyone that’s quite quite quite unusual, isn’t it?

Kirsty Hague (04:51.2)
I love this, we have a lot in common.

Chris (04:54.682)
Yeah. did your, Kirsty, your art interest, did you say psychotherapy?

Kirsty Hague (04:58.83)
Yeah, so I studied art and psychology at uni to get a modular degree because I kind of thought, shall I go from be a designer? But I wasn’t really ready for that when I was 17. I always, always felt that I was more drawn to working with people. And then when I came back from traveling, I landed up getting a job in mental health and ended up running residential homes for young adolescents coming out of…

Chris (05:04.271)
Vine.

Chris (05:12.069)
Hmm.

Chris (05:17.603)
Vont.

Kirsty Hague (05:26.414)
well, being institutionalised and hospitalised. And so I did that for seven years and ended up running residential homes, management that way. And then, kind of, yeah, just learned all my management skills on that side. stick with the art and psychology, so it worked really well.

Chris (05:28.963)
Bye.

Chris (05:40.965)
Mmm.

So the art design and interior bit has been with you for a long while, which is kind of the bit that is your major contribution.

Kirsty Hague (05:51.054)
once said when I was 17, no, earlier than that, 14, that I should have been an interior designer and I went, oh no, I never felt confident enough at that stage of my life to do it and I always felt I was just drawn, as I say, drawn to work with people and community arts and then now look what I’m doing now all these years later, so.

Chris (06:02.709)
Mm.

Chris (06:07.919)
Hmm. Yeah. So how did it? was gonna ask Jim, when did you start then Haig Dental?

Kirsty Hague (06:13.326)
In 96 it was just as a one-man band just repairing pumps compressors It was just a dream no it wasn’t I Chose dental because my brother-in-law was already working as a dental engineer like a freelance Before then I’d already worked on suction pumps and compressors, but in the aquatic industry

Chris (06:20.163)
Why did you choose dental?

Chris (06:24.447)
Hahaha!

Chris (06:33.658)
Right.

Chris (06:39.973)
I say

Kirsty Hague (06:41.962)
sea life but also marine shops and as a hobby I’ve already been diving for years so was sort of common sense to me so working it was very quick I don’t want to sound big-headed but it was very quick learning I could just see where things went wrong diagnostics was always something I was interested in so I sort of apply that to the dental industry and it just seemed to sort of take off from there there was no plan or anything

Chris (07:03.513)
Mm.

Kirsty Hague (07:11.054)
It was when I was 23, no 24 years old. And then I just started fixing things.

Chris (07:19.459)
Right, yeah. Yeah, and the business has moved on somewhat since then, hasn’t it? And when did you join then, Kirstie? When did you join?

Kirsty Hague (07:25.838)
So after, basically when Jim set up on his so had eight years on his own and then he had a back and needed somebody else to come and help lift these heavy chairs basically. So we got a few guys from down at the Cricket Club, one who’s James, who’s been working with us 18 years now. And…

Chris (07:44.995)
Wow.

Kirsty Hague (07:47.308)
Yeah, from there, I used come up and bring the bacon sandwiches to the guys. And then it got to the point where I was bossing Jim around telling him that he needed to do appraisals and business stuff. It my last experience. And then Jim said, well, you’re to have to come and do it. I did accounts for about two weeks, then walked out. And then said, I’ll come do a bit of marketing for you. So for a long time, well.

Chris (07:59.238)
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

Chris (08:06.936)
You

Kirsty Hague (08:11.392)
for most of my career here before I did in pure interiors. Then I was doing customer service, but obviously mainly the marketing side. So promoting the brilliant work that I felt that the guys did. So it was such a nice job because I truly believed in what they set up and how they worked.

Chris (08:24.549)
Mm.

Chris (08:28.925)
Wow. lots of people that listen to this are dentists, but there’s also the trade and other people. And there’s many people who are in business with family members, husband or wife. How do you guys manage it in terms of the on and the off switch to make sure that you’re not always talking about business or you end up bringing home stuff into the office? How does that work?

Kirsty Hague (08:50.37)
We do have a bit of a rule that we don’t tend to talk about at home, which doesn’t always go to plan, and particularly when we’ve had a couple of glasses of wine, it ends up steering that way somehow. But I would say a lot of the time we try not to talk too much about business at home, otherwise everything gets blurred into one.

Chris (09:03.545)
Ha

Chris (09:12.758)
No.

Chris (09:16.005)
But yeah.

Kirsty Hague (09:17.518)
And actually in the beginning of the, when I came into the business for a long time we worked quite separately. Although I work in the business, Jim did his thing but I was running customer service and doing marketing and he was off looking after engineers and doing the sales. we kind of just teamed together and it just always worked together.

really really well. Over recent years it’s changed because we’ve got we’ve got an MD now which we might come to talking about but yeah so now we’re just focusing on the bits we like and we actually work together more than ever now than we ever did, so which is good.

Chris (09:37.295)
Hmm.

Chris (09:50.654)
Right, yeah. And in the early days, back in the sort of late 90s, early noughties, what were the pain points of starting a business, growing a business? Because again, lots of people in dentistry go through this. There’s lots of people with relatively young businesses. And I’d be interested to know what were the things that affected you, whether that resonates with people today or whether things have changed?

Kirsty Hague (10:14.414)
I can only really answer from me and from Haig Dental. I I’ve been doing this since I was 24. It’s the only real business I know now. So the pain point was I worked on my own. Alice Kirste said for eight years, I did not realize how lonely I was. I was working 100 plus hours a week, moving dental chairs on my own. I was damaging myself, injuring.

Chris (10:17.7)
Yeah.

Chris (10:27.343)
that.

Chris (10:36.314)
Wow.

Chris (10:39.909)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (10:42.094)
to the point where then I took people on and inside of about three months it went from just me to four people when I realized that actually I could trust people to go and work and it’s finding the right people, putting your trust in them to carry on what you’ve done but to compromise that no one’s gonna have the same passion that you have for starting.

Chris (10:57.509)
Hmm.

Yes.

Chris (11:08.793)
Mmm. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Kirsty Hague (11:11.448)
but a lot of good people are here and they do come close to that. for me, it’s always been remembering what I stood for at the beginning. So just to do an honest job to say, to turn up when you say you’re gonna turn up and to do it. And that’s what I expect from the staff really.

Chris (11:21.242)
Mm.

Chris (11:29.029)
Yeah, it’s an interesting one, isn’t it? Really Jim? Because she by the sounds things, you know, set it up in was it 96 one man band eight years and Did during that time you think to yourself? I’m gonna grow into a really big business or was it the fact of when you did your backing? Suddenly suddenly you thought oh flip I need to and then then it then it moved on I’m just thinking a sort of similarity to some of the dentist isn’t that they start as a dentist and then they sort of

Kirsty Hague (11:44.108)
Yes.

Chris (11:54.992)
they sort of buy a practice because some of them move into it, but they didn’t really know what they’re doing. And then suddenly they’ve now got a business and they have to learn on the hoof, which by the sounds of things is what you did really.

Kirsty Hague (12:04.782)
similar. You end up doing a job that isn’t you. So the beginning I was an engineer, diagnostic, meeting people, just working out what’s wrong, sorting it out. But before I know it, I’m an MD, I’m an FD, I’m sitting there doing VAC accounts, I’m working all hours just to sort of fit in accounts and managing people, but begrudgingly that’s not something that really is me.

Chris (12:10.383)
Mm. Mm-hmm.

Chris (12:21.413)
Yeah, yeah

Chris (12:26.789)
Mmm.

Chris (12:31.078)
It’s not your strength, is it? It’s interesting you said about loneliness as well, Jim, because I think as a solopreneur, that that’s a massive thing. And people don’t really know where to go. Because particularly what you were doing, that’s quite a niche thing to be doing. So there weren’t really many other people to talk to about what it is that you did and what you do and the challenges you’ve got, but from a kind of technical standpoint. And I don’t think it’s many that different for dentists.

Most dental practices or independently owned practices have one principle. So the same applies to them. like, where’d you go? And that loneliness builds up and you kind of got to be careful who you seek counsel from because people have bias about how they’re going to advise you. You don’t really want to talking about the financial confidential sensitive stuff with too many people because again, that’s awkward. As we were just talking about with you two, you don’t also want to take it home because you want to have a life away from there. So you can see how you end up kind of bottling this up.

Kirsty Hague (13:23.052)
Mm-hmm.

Chris (13:28.281)
which again isn’t a particularly healthy situation, is it?

Kirsty Hague (13:31.018)
I think the key thing, and I say this to anybody who’s got their own business, whether it’s friends or wherever I speak to, the turning point for us was actually spending a bit more on better staff. Not looking for people necessarily on a local level, friends of friends or anything like that, was actually investing in the right people.

Chris (13:44.441)
Mm-hmm.

Chris (13:48.527)
Mm.

Chris (13:53.379)
Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (13:54.2)
having, you know, taking that risk to invest that more money. And I see that with practice as well. A lot of the time, obviously, you know, maybe spend a bit more on just a better quality, more experienced staff member because they’ll hold your hand and they’ll have your back. Whereas other, know, younger, less experienced people just don’t have that experience or that confidence to do that. So that was very much the turning point when we brought an FD in and now an MD for the last few years. So.

Chris (14:09.411)
Hmm. Yeah.

Chris (14:16.876)
It’s like…

Kirsty Hague (14:23.598)
But that was key really. But we’ve now got a senior management team that then help protect us. all of that makes a real big difference.

Chris (14:32.229)
Yeah. It’s transformation. think we quite often it’s interesting. So we say it’s a dentist. say, know, for a period you’re going to end up making probably less money because it’s going to cost you money. But actually the end result is going to be better. So you should do it. quite often they won’t, Oh, I don’t want to spend that amount of money, but yeah, your, your benefits will be further down the line.

Kirsty Hague (14:52.622)
personally on a health level, mental health level, everything like that. And it’s nice because you can share that experience, not just with us, between us, but really share that passion and they’re engaged in that. And yeah, that’s the bit I really enjoy now, sharing our business.

Chris (14:57.071)
Mm.

Chris (15:07.236)
Hmm

Chris (15:13.392)
So it’s really moved on in that you’ve now got a team of over 40 people. So if we flick to the other end, what are the challenges that come with managing a business of that size? Because that’s quite a significant business you’ve got now.

Kirsty Hague (15:18.158)
Okay.

Kirsty Hague (15:26.35)
As somebody like me, in all honesty, as the company grew, the position became worse. I enjoyed it less and less. It was about eight years ago I decided to bring in business partners. People who want to run a business. It was never my ambition. I like…

Chris (15:35.746)
Right.

Chris (15:44.197)
Mm.

Kirsty Hague (15:46.542)
I love going out with people and having a good time, but mad management, being a team leader, all those things. I’ve got great people that don’t need that from me. So as the company grew,

Chris (16:00.176)
Ha ha ha.

Kirsty Hague (16:06.272)
said it was fantastic but for me the problem wasn’t. It was quite the opposite really. So we decided to bring some business partners in, who work in a like industry, in the water management industry and then to bring an MD in, someone who knows what they’re doing, not like an engineer like me, and an FD, someone who can do it properly, who can just get that extra hour sleep at night just to know it’s all covered.

life since then it was definitely the right thing to do.

Chris (16:37.348)
Yeah, yeah. I tell you, it’s a brilliant lesson yet again for anyone listening in the fact of it’s not all about money. know, your business is growing financially, you’re probably getting off better and better every year, but actually from a satisfaction point of view, it’s getting worse every year. you, I think the great thing is you recognised it and you were able to say, actually we need to change. Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (16:58.542)
But I think also we recognised there were some very loyal staff members we had over the years who we wanted to be able to give them an opportunity to grow. And so bringing the investment in meant that we could do all the things that we kept talking about wanting to do and never got a chance to. So it meant that we sat back in, you know, sales director and interiors and then we brought other good people in and rose other people up in the business.

Chris (17:24.325)
Mmm.

Kirsty Hague (17:24.814)
which was, honestly, it’s changed our life personally as well as for the business as well. It’s all been well.

Chris (17:29.733)
That’s brilliant. Do you sweat small stuff? Or does one of you sweat small stuff and one of you doesn’t? Do the small things bother you or do you quite a big picture?

Kirsty Hague (17:39.734)
Bye.

Kirsty Hague (17:43.791)
I don’t really understand the question like stubbing your toe or something though

Chris (17:48.23)
Yeah, or do you obsess about small little things in the business that aren’t going well? Is it all the small details that you really obsess about? Or are you quiet, big picture, we’ve got a strategy, this is where we’re going, some things might go wrong, but that’s just a byproduct of trying to get to a bigger thing? Or is it on a daily basis, those little things really get to you?

Kirsty Hague (18:05.814)
I think.

Kirsty Hague (18:09.304)
think we both care a lot about the quality and there was such a lot of integrity and care that we put into doing what we do. Really, the business has grown through offering the right solutions to our customers. So customers for years would come and say, can you, I don’t know, upholster things or upholster chairs, all these kind of small added services that we provide.

Chris (18:24.879)
Mm.

Chris (18:34.405)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (18:36.278)
you probably wouldn’t even see on the website, but we always responded to what customers asked us to do. And so always put in that care between Jim and I, and that is the bit that, if you say what we stress about, is maintaining that ethos, that quality of care, integrity. That’s the bit that I think both of us really feel like, if there’s anything, they’re niggly. That’s the bit we feel.

Chris (18:53.807)
Mm.

Chris (19:01.061)
When you look at some of the interiors that you’ve done, I I’ve followed you on Instagram, think some of those interiors are like, well, I’d never have thought about that for a dental practice, you know, it’s like, and is that your input into them? Or is it one of those ones that they sort of say to you, I’d like it to look like, know, whatever it might be. And then you sort of try and translate that and say, look, if you’re not careful, there’s going to be a line between classy and a curry house.

Kirsty Hague (19:09.037)
and

Chris (19:28.289)
or a brothel, you know, because some of them are like so ostentatious, aren’t they, that it must be quite hard to sort of almost dial them back a bit and saying, whoa, hang on a minute,

Kirsty Hague (19:33.23)
in the world.

Kirsty Hague (19:38.03)
It’s very, the way that I work as a designer is very much on a personal one-to-one level. It’s come from that background that I had before. It’s all about working with the people and what one person wants in their dental practice is very different to another. And there are definitely clients who want that very high-end look at the moment and they’re bringing in high-end, very high-end clients. So you kind of need that to go with it. But then for a lot of others, they don’t want that because you use the word ostentatious. And I think

Chris (19:59.969)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (20:08.044)
you know, that it has to be comfortable to the people coming in the door. But the main thing for me is that I don’t see it from the angle necessarily of the patients coming in. I always view it that if you’ve got a, if the dentist and the principal and the team are happy in their practice, then things, people, clients and patients will come in the door. So I work with them very much to create an environment that they love.

Chris (20:11.855)
Mmm.

Chris (20:29.634)
Mm. Mm.

Chris (20:34.457)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Kirsty Hague (20:35.342)
Look online you’ll see this one in Cambridge that we did a couple of years back, which is Specialist ortho practice, but that is Francis driven That is him, you know, like he loves that but it’s completely different to anything else you’ll see out there And I love creating spaces that always be unique If you look at any of my wide design then then it’s I’m passionate about making it unique for that person

Chris (21:01.229)
Hmm. Yeah. And has the model of a dental practice, I think probably from an engineering and layout point of view for Jim, but from a kind of a style, a marketing, a presentation point of view, has that evolved? obviously lots of dental practices in the country have been in former residential properties. They’re quite old. And so people who are doing new things, are they still conforming to what you saw?

20 years ago or is it evolving?

Kirsty Hague (21:33.378)
really varies. think when I walk into a dental practice I can see whether it’s a 70s, 80s, 90s, naught design, whereas nowadays it seems to be a whole variety. Some people just want a like for like, they want an L-shaped planetary, they want to have a dental chair that’s right hand only and that’s how they work and that works well for them. Somebody else wants it very minimalistic.

Chris (21:39.983)
Yeah.

Chris (21:56.303)
Mm. Yep.

Mm.

Kirsty Hague (22:00.648)
centralizing storage, they want a lot less in the surgery, a feeling of space, trying to avoid the fact that it’s a dental surgery and obviously until you need the instruments and the handpieces. it serves well for high-end and anxious patients but really the flavor from the beginning as soon as you walk in.

Chris (22:06.041)
Hmm.

Chris (22:18.81)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (22:24.398)
the stuff that Kirstie works on with the interior design, bringing it in, obviously we talk about high-end projects, but also on a budget. People want to create a real wow, and typically they’re spending more on the initial reception, the externals, than they are perhaps going for an entry or mid-level dental chair. Ten years ago, people would go for the high-end chair and just have a standard…

Chris (22:32.399)
video.

Chris (22:51.717)
That’s interesting, isn’t it?

Kirsty Hague (22:52.832)
whereas everybody wants to create that impression.

Chris (22:56.134)
I think that’s the way the world’s moved though, isn’t it? I think that initial aesthetic when you go in anywhere, whether it’s a shop or a restaurant or a cafe or a bar, you do get a feeling for what it’s like. in some ways it’s slightly sad that they’ve almost kind of downgraded on the technical equipment, but upgraded on the aesthetic. I think that’s just the way it feels like the world’s moved that way.

Kirsty Hague (23:19.182)
It’s all social media led in all honesty in my eyes because if you have a website, the website has to represent your brand. You have to have it running from, if you’re doing social media, then you want everyone that’s asking for a wall to do filming, for Instagram.

Chris (23:23.269)
Hmm.

Chris (23:28.761)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris (23:37.093)
Mm.

Kirsty Hague (23:40.046)
When we’re designing practices now, I don’t know whether people realise this, but we’re not only looking at the inside, but we’re looking at the outside. So from the moment they drive up, instantly know where they’re going. that patient flow starts from the front door as such. But they know it because they’ve seen it on social media, they recognise it, and then it takes it all the way through the practice. And really, obviously, people talk a lot about patient journey.

Chris (23:56.773)
Mmm.

Kirsty Hague (24:06.51)
But that is very much how we perceive it. My role is somewhat duller. I have to push all of that to one side. The speeds won’t go wrong. A compressor or a suction pump will go wrong. So that we need a backup solution. And we need to leave space for this. We need services. You should have a washer disinfector. Don’t forget about radiography shielding. All these extremely dull items.

Chris (24:14.021)
Ha ha

Chris (24:21.743)
Yeah.

Hmm.

Chris (24:32.773)
Mmm.

Kirsty Hague (24:33.518)
you’ll be glad when the infrastructure is in place when it comes to it. And that’s my challenge nowadays. It’s working with Kirstie on projects, but trying to keep the interest of the client. When we’re in a showroom visit, because we have a really big showroom visit, showroom here with equipment in, we also have an interiors area now. And Jim has to stop them talking to me because as soon as they got drawn in to talking about the nice flat, the nice pretty bit.

Chris (24:35.348)
Mm hmm. Yeah.

Chris (24:46.947)
Yeah.

Chris (25:02.521)
Yeah, the sparkly bit.

Kirsty Hague (25:03.081)
You keep insisting on talking about compressors and plugs. I’m just a tea boy. I’ll just get the drinks, I’ll clear up.

Chris (25:08.869)
On the equipment side of things Jim. It’s exciting bit though isn’t it? cabinetry and what it looks like. I think that the modern day stuff generally, know, televisions, fridges, freezers, tech type stuff, it tends not to last as long as perhaps it did years ago. What’s the state of dental equipment? Is it still well built? Is it as good as it was in days of old? Is it more difficult to repair and service than it was? Because you’ve obviously got…

know, experience dating back to the mid 90s. So you’ve got a great, great span of time.

Kirsty Hague (25:39.81)
Yeah, good question. So for me, I would say some of it is built as it used to be in old days. So there are certain items where they are built to a price. They’re trying to cram as much technology in as possible.

Chris (25:48.773)
Mm.

Chris (25:56.57)
Right.

Chris (26:00.134)
Right.

Kirsty Hague (26:01.198)
when you’re corners on technology, perhaps a design life of eight years, rather than just building things. The way the Victorians did, we’ll build it with a huge stature of safety and it will last for 40 years. So, I mean, there’s still equipment out there that was made in the UK. That’s how old some of the equipment is that I see. It’s the 70s equipment. That’s where we really started. finished with the chairs and that’s still working. Looking very tired, not giving the image that the…

Chris (26:09.412)
Yeah.

Chris (26:21.551)
Wow. But still working. Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (26:30.37)
they want being pulled out because of the aesthetics but what I’m putting in there will it last 50 years? Probably not. We’re asking modern equipment so much more and price-wise it’s very competitive when you compare backwards. So if I think of a triple pack of handpieces from a reputable manufacturer 20 years ago

Chris (26:31.109)
Yeah.

Chris (26:40.687)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (26:55.828)
it’s probably only a hundred pounds more for the same content now. Somewhere along the lines things have been cut, unless you go for the top range, but then you are paying double, which is in line with costs before. there are chair packages out there for sixty thousand pounds, there are some around the ten thousand pound mark. If your budget is low, my advice to people would be to buy basic.

Chris (27:15.491)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (27:23.198)
not putting it down but go for something which is just tried and tested, perhaps doesn’t have all the belts and braces but yeah that will last 20 years. Buy something cheaply with all the technology on it it will probably be good for four years, five years changing it. don’t know whether you know but Jim when Jim first set up he started selling used equipment.

Chris (27:34.447)
Mm.

Chris (27:41.689)
Not.

Chris (27:48.709)
Kirsty Hague (27:49.13)
You know, we’ve still got a user equipment site today.

Chris (27:52.773)
okay.

Kirsty Hague (27:54.03)
but it was always that, know, like for years people were taking chairs out of surgeries and just dumping them. But we always took them back in, refurbished them and then sold them on. And then how it would happen is that people would buy a secondhand chair and then when they were ready and they had money coming in, we would upgrade. So we’d take that chair back again and then upgrade it to new maybe.

Chris (28:01.903)
Mm-hmm.

Chris (28:17.647)
Like almost like a loner. Yeah, a bit of an interim. Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (28:23.114)
So it’s something we don’t do so much of now because so many people are buying on finance but you know we are doing it more and more in the last year I think again actually. Possibly as a company grows that it’s very very difficult if you don’t know the full service history, if you don’t know the improvement inside out it’s very difficult to then say I know that will last at least 10 years. Not a 10 year warranty but I

Chris (28:28.229)
Sure, yeah.

Chris (28:41.357)
Yeah.

Chris (28:47.631)
Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (28:50.9)
sell something that I think wouldn’t last the test of time. Occasionally we get something relatively new or something I’ve put in. In fact there’s one tomorrow I’m looking at near Wimbledon where they bought it from me 15 years ago secondhand so it must be about 30 years old now looking to go new. So it stood the test of time.

Chris (28:53.637)
Yeah, sure.

Chris (29:09.413)
It lasted, Yeah.

Kirsty Hague (29:12.974)
exactly that. The amount of practices Jim goes into and like he’s like he sold that like 15 years ago and he’s like I sold you that old that Tri-Dact chair but it’s gone on and on you know it’s really nice when you go back and people remember you from selling.

Chris (29:19.749)
Wow.

Yeah.

Chris (29:28.973)
Yeah, what’s that continuity is now? think that’s where it’s that’s where it’s really important. We get it with valuations or you know, or even when we used to bank funding many, many years ago. Yeah, yeah, you lent me money to buy my first practice and that must be at least 30 years. It’s important, isn’t it? It’s important for them. Yeah, to them. It’s it’s like a crucial moment, isn’t it? We see we see quite a lot of people who are musing on the thought of setting up a squat practice and I you help people.

from the earliest kind of concept, thinking about it, and then design from an equipment design point of view and an interior design point of view. On a timeline, if someone’s considering a project, when should they start talking to you? Is it good for them to talk to you really early on so you have input, or if they come to you with ideas? What would be your preferred option?

Kirsty Hague (30:19.116)
I would say the earlier the better because particularly we get involved, we can look at sites for people. I know we’ve talked to you guys about that quite a lot about whether that site is particularly suitable for practice. we’re helping them to understand, you know, really whether the square footage is adequate for the business they want to grow, not just for the first year, but.

Chris (30:20.718)
Right.

Chris (30:28.932)
Yeah.

Chris (30:34.148)
Mm.

Chris (30:40.293)
Hmm. Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (30:44.878)
for the next 10, 20, 30 years, is that the right property for you? Looking at things like access, disabled, all these things that people don’t necessarily think about when they’re first looking at a site, things around bill control, fire, all these kinds of things. We understand obviously legislation and CQC, we can help advise. And I think it’s interesting because sometimes people will go to a CQC advisor,

Chris (30:45.017)
Mm.

Chris (31:01.861)
Mm.

Kirsty Hague (31:15.214)
go to someone to talk about compliance company before they’ll come to us but but we’re involved in compliance every day here at Hay whether it’s equipment or through you know design that’s kind of like our

Chris (31:31.269)
Mmm.

Chris (31:35.309)
Mmm.

Chris (31:40.453)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (31:41.55)
So I really encourage everyone to get in touch as early as possible, even if you’ve just found a property that you’re looking at. I totally agree, but I’ll just add that it’s… I suppose we’re gifted in a very different way to a dentist. I can say that because I tried dentistry once on a course with ADEC about 10 years ago. I found out two things. One is that I’m terrible at dentistry and the second thing is I need glasses.

Chris (31:48.035)
But

Chris (32:08.633)
Ha ha ha ha ha.

Kirsty Hague (32:09.71)
It made me really badly, but it helped me sort of empathise with how the dentist works and what they do. I took away from that, but it made me realise that how I can see a space and I can automatically look at a 2D plan or just walk around a derelict building and I can automatically piece it all together. my customers, I would say probably about 5 % can.

Chris (32:15.429)
Hmm.

Kirsty Hague (32:33.752)
they just cannot see it and our job is to help them see it. If someone’s doing a squat, so it’s their first practice, they need a lot of different questions almost like you took for us to help them to work out what they need. So that we’re doing all of this before you even look to build it because it would be a fluke if you didn’t know space, you didn’t know what you wanted and you’ve chosen a building that that was right for the job.

Chris (32:36.549)
Hmm.

Chris (32:44.954)
Hmm.

Chris (32:59.128)
Mmm. That fitted you.

Kirsty Hague (33:01.462)
It would be the right location, but if we can help with that, we’ve also got 20 vans on the road. We’ve got project managers, sales team out. So if I say, we’re looking for a site in Ealing or we really want something around Wolfenstowe, then we can drive around and have a look. This one’s available. So often I’m sort of just emailing a client, a prospective client to say, what do you think about this?

Chris (33:27.749)
about you.

Kirsty Hague (33:28.46)
recently on Guildford High Street. I just got a bit of So it’s almost like a state agency. There’s no challenge for that, but it’s just putting people together.

Chris (33:30.949)
interesting.

Chris (33:35.747)
Hmm.

Chris (33:39.095)
Part of what you do. Away from dentistry, you both love a gig and a festival, don’t you?

Kirsty Hague (33:44.91)
Me more please, more than him really.

Chris (33:47.513)
So what’s, so you both get to answer it. What’s your favorite song and why?

Kirsty Hague (33:52.302)
Oh god. Well, it’s not particularly, I wouldn’t say it’s a particular song. Like when I first met Jim, I hate it. He took me to clubs in Plymouth where I was at university and took me to raves and lots of house music and I absolutely hated it. And now I love it.

Chris (34:13.381)
Ha ha ha ha

Kirsty Hague (34:16.142)
I drag him to festivals for dance music but we both love music, all different types of music and our kids do too so yeah if ever an opportunity for a gig, we drive our friends mad. Do want to come to this? you want come to this? All right, thank you. So I wouldn’t say a particular song but I definitely, we booked a cell phone to go to an Ibiza Weekender about five years ago.

Chris (34:31.973)
Big fish, little fish, cardboard box.

Chris (34:41.549)
brilliant. Excellent.

Kirsty Hague (34:42.414)
So we did that for a weekend, but we felt we were way too old to do it, but we realised when we got there we really weren’t, because actually that’s the people who worked since our generation, so it was brilliant to make it look like we it.

Chris (34:50.597)
That’s our generation,

And if it’s a phone party, you can’t see anyone anyway.

Kirsty Hague (34:59.086)
Leave a safe song by James Brown for sure. It depends. If I’m allowed to, then I would say You Got Ants in Your Pants by James Brown if you’re quite in a lively mood or Frankie Knuckles’ Whistle Song if you’re feeling in a quiet relaxed mood. Very mellow, exactly. Yes, exactly. Gives it into my personality, perhaps.

Chris (35:14.469)
Look at that, covers both of the extremes there. Brilliant.

Yeah, we also have two questions that we ask at the end of every episode and you both you both get to answer different answers. So if you could be a fly on the wall in a situation, where would you be and who would be there?

Kirsty Hague (35:38.552)
You go first. I would go back 800,000 years, almost maybe a million years to the first fire. Not the first fire that’s built by man. Just to watch the reaction to having…

done something, running out of the cave, so scared to then run back in, then the moment of realization, I can be warm now, I can cook on this. How proud would you be of that?

Chris (36:03.257)
Mm.

Chris (36:11.685)
Mum, mum, look! I made fire! Brilliant.

Kirsty Hague (36:13.446)
Look at my family, they’re amazing. So that’s Jim’s answer and when I talked to him about it, was like, mine’s completely different. Mine’s just like, I love my kids and my family so much. Having grown up with just my mum, my kids and Jim mean everything to me. So it would just literally be a fly on the wall on seeing like on a day where our family are all…

together and maybe at a festival together or something like that so very basic and down to earth.

Chris (36:40.421)
Nice.

Chris (36:44.621)
No, but nice as well. And if you were given the opportunity to meet somebody, sit down, cup of coffee, glass of wine, who would you take the chance to sit down with?

Kirsty Hague (36:54.794)
it would be Isambard, Kingdon, Burnell. It is the first one to put a tunnel under a river, and that’s almost 200 years ago now. And that’s the Robber Hive, so going under the Thames. you’ve got the first steamship. The railways, it’s just amazing.

Chris (36:57.03)
As a engineer.

Chris (37:03.941)
Yeah.

Chris (37:11.715)
and still in use as well, yeah.

Kirsty Hague (37:24.078)
and he lived to 53, so he achieved so much in such a short time.

Chris (37:29.359)
Yeah, yeah. I think that’s civil engineering, when you can use kind of maths and science to design something and just know that it’s going to work. So to dig a tunnel under a river and just know that you understand the science and the logistics and it will be okay. It’s pretty cool. And everything. Yeah, it’s pretty cool.

Kirsty Hague (37:48.136)
Everyone else is telling you it’s not possible. They’re telling you the steamship won’t make to America. The tunnel will collapse and the Clifton suspension bridge. They’re telling you all of those things won’t work and then you do it and they work. Smug. I thought that I just want to be in a bar in the Caribbean and Amy Winehouse would walk in the door.

Chris (37:56.577)
Yeah, yeah, beauty.

Chris (38:01.465)
Mm. Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

Chris (38:15.884)
okay.

Kirsty Hague (38:17.07)
And I suppose it’s partly as a background as a therapist as well, kind of, you know, just, but she’s amazing. She’s amazing and will always be missed. mean, whenever you hear her voice, you just want to be in that bar without in the sun listening to her. She’s amazing. that was good.

Chris (38:30.937)
Yeah.

Chris (38:34.809)
Absolutely. Brilliant. Well, thank you both. It’s been wonderful. They diverse. They were. They were. Yeah, they scooted around. But it’s just great to hear your story. And yeah, like I say, there aren’t that many people in dentistry that have been around for so long, but through a period of change, not just for your business, a change in dentistry. So it’s nice to sort of pick through some of that. We really appreciate your time. Yeah.

Well, we’ll look after yourselves. Thank you very much indeed for joining us. We’ll see you at an event somewhere. Exactly, we’ll see you at a show or somewhere soon. Brilliant. Thanks guys. guys. Cheers.

Kirsty Hague (39:01.518)
Cheers.