Transcript – Dentology Podcast Recording with Shaz Memon
Episode release date – Monday 22 May 2023
Andy & Chris:
It’s always special when you get friends back, isn’t it? It is, it is. It’s very enjoyable. It’s very enjoyable. It’s like having
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
a chat down the pub or the coffee shop, depending on your suasion. It is, it is.
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Much easier as well, isn’t
Andy & Chris:
Exactly.
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it?
Andy & Chris:
So today, we are so pleased. A friend is back to join us. We’ve got the founder of Digimax, the world’s number one dental marketing agency. What work? The author of Instagram for Dentists, now in its second edition. And it’s thicker, as you’ve seen. It’s much thicker than it was before. Useful to holding doors open.
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I’m sorry.
Andy & Chris:
Amazon and an Amazon bestseller don’t you know? Well, who loves an Amazon bestseller? But today, the important part of this person is the founder of Wells on Wheels, a water wheel charity project. So welcome Shaz Memon. How are you? Hello.
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Very well. Thank you for having me back again. I feel extremely honored Yeah, good to be back
Andy & Chris:
It is. It’s lovely to have you and good cause. Well, it is. And it’s lovely because you were in our, you are an all-goal guest. When we started Dentology, the podcast back in July, 2021,
[email protected]:
Wow.
Andy & Chris:
we didn’t really know where it was going. We knew we wanted to meet certain objectives. Our objectives were we wanted to hear life stories. We wanted to share some business tips and want to just have fun. And you were there recently with us when we did our live event with Millard.
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Yep.
Andy & Chris:
Dentology Live event. Who would have thought that in less than two years we’d have gone from having nothing to starting with you to then running that event. So it’s been really cool.
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It’s amazing for me to see because you get approached by people starting podcasts all the time, but very few people stick to it and are consistent. And I think recently you shared with me, what was it? Number one business podcast in the world?
Andy & Chris:
Top
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Top
Andy & Chris:
5%
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5%.
Andy & Chris:
Top 5% Yeah, this is podcasting the world. Gonna get t-shirts printed and everything’s just…
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And within dentistry, what I love about your podcast, it’s not the, you know, blow your own trumpet show. It’s quite genuine and you get quite unique guests on there as well. And your event most recently, I mean, I messaged you and I wrote to you on Facebook. None of us knew it’s going to turn out like that. It’s such a unique concept to be in a live podcast recording with that set up, the venue, the people that were there. So I think you guys are very good at getting the right. people in one room, except for one or two of course, but yeah.
Andy & Chris:
You’ve always got to invite those people. Yeah, we must apologize on behalf of those. So
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Yeah, yeah.
Andy & Chris:
yeah, it’s gone well. It’s gone well. And fairly recently, we also spoke to Bavin and Meg Bann, who are also ambassadors of Wells on Wheels. And they spent a period of time over December through into the new year, basically trekking their adventure to deliver some water wheels. And we did a recording on that. And it was great to get their story in. not only how it impacted them, but how it impacted their kids. I know they’re looking to try to go back, but that as a sound bite of what happened was great, but we thought it would be really nice to chat to you today just to get a wider perspective on where Wells and Wheels is at, how’s the project going, what impacts it having. So perhaps just as a starter, could you kind of just set this thing for some people that don’t know about Wells and Wheels and what it is and what it is and what you set out? When it starts and all that sort of stuff. Yeah.
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Sure,
Andy & Chris:
Bit
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sure.
Andy & Chris:
of potted history.
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So I started Wells and Wheels in 2019 and Andy if you remember we were meeting, me you, Chris, Harry Patel from Ice Connect, we were meeting up and we were sitting outside a pub just for a moment before we got our reservation. I think it was in Marleyburn we’re going to eat at Trishnan. I said to you Andy, this is what I’m going to start. What do you think? And you’re like amazing. And it’s a bit like your podcast, you know, it started with this idea. And the idea was… still in 2023, girls every day get up in the morning, young girls, and they are going to a well to collect water. So instead of turning the tap on, their process before that tap thing and getting access to water is walking many miles in the heat. So you carry these pots and then you carry them back. So they’re like heavy suitcases. Imagine that carrying that and to save time, they’ll sometimes stack one or two above their head. Now, I mean, we couldn’t do it. But with enough practice for years, you can do it. And really what they’re doing is they’re compressing their spine.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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The big thing is that aside from the obvious physical issues, is they’re not attending school. So the Indian government have put schools, NGOs have put schools in these villages. The attendance is just boys. So these girls cannot access school because they cannot access water. And when I first set out to solve this issue through an invention of some kind which meant more water could be transported from A to B without it having a physical burden and it also meant one person could go which is mum it would hopefully mean that the girls could be free to enjoy their childhood that was the initial idea so girls don’t need to go I didn’t know the education element at all the education element kind of presented itself to me as a byproduct which I was like what so these girls are now going to school with their spare time. And as I got to know every village we did this in, because these Indian girls are so ambitious, they love studying, the focus then became, actually, this is water and education. We’re solving an education
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.
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problem, not just a childhood problem. And it all came quite naturally to me, actually, because I got softened up when I had a daughter. So, Helene is six now, and 29, she’s a little bit younger. But it just made me, I was a bit ashamed of myself that I felt, you know, being a parent meant only Molly coddling this one individual.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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What about all the forgotten children of the world? So really, that’s the insight into how it all started.
Andy & Chris:
That’s a lovely story. Lovely story. And are there any kind of standout moments for you? I know when we spoke to Bamford and Meg and they told us their story of going to… Motorbikes breaking down. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, they said that, yeah, it was, wasn’t it? That they got so far on their journey in vehicles they couldn’t get there. So the car break down or something. And then you, I think it was you, didn’t you, managed to organize
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I’m
Andy & Chris:
some…
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coordinating
Andy & Chris:
Yeah. Yeah.
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it from here. So this village is in middle of nowhere. If you’re coming from this side, it’s like dead end. You cannot get there. If you’re coming from this side where my team are coming from, it’s not like the M25 where I just take the next junction is
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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either you can get there or you can’t get there. So they’re obviously getting frustrated and worried. They’ve got children in the car and they’re like, we can’t get to this place. We can’t see it. It’s just, we’re just, it’s just rocks. So luckily, I could get into contact with my team because sometimes they’re completely cut off and we don’t have satellite phones or any of that.
Andy & Chris:
Not
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Luckily
Andy & Chris:
the
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I can
Andy & Chris:
US
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get
Andy & Chris:
military.
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through to. and they sent motorbikes to where they were. Luckily they could find them and they brought them to the village. And what’s fascinating is, every village, even though the setup is usually the same, it’s rural, disconnected, children are collecting water, that’s the commonality. What’s not common is how you access it. Sometimes we’ve got the villages from tractors, sometimes they’ve walked. six miles and got to middle of nowhere because they’ve been walking in the wrong direction. Every situation when it comes to wheel deliveries has been so different and I was so ignorant to this in the beginning because I would put pressure on the team over there why aren’t we doing four deliveries a week why is it only two? Excuse me and they said Shaz you don’t understand you cannot get there and it’s 40 degrees heat but I wasn’t having it and it’s it’s only now. Like when Bhavin went and he explained it in his way, like, you know, it’s different. There’s a language
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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barrier as well, right? So to me, sometimes it sounds like they’re not trying hard enough.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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Then I’ll give them motivational talks. You couldn’t achieve anything if you put your mind to it,
Andy & Chris:
Hahaha!
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is that it? But
Andy & Chris:
Whoah!
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they’re like, physically
Andy & Chris:
Whoah!
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we cannot get there. So when Bhavin shared his story of him going with his children, how disconnected this village was, how his children said, they’re going to remember this forever for the first time they really appreciate the benefits that they have living in England in a privileged society. Even that’s brand new to me because I’ve never, I’ve never bought, took my daughter there. I’ve never taken my family there. So their visit and how Bavin articulated it and how giving he was to give up his Christmas holidays with his wife and family really was heart-wrenching when I heard some of the stories but it all had a happy ending. The girls in this village no longer have to collect water.
Andy & Chris:
Is there a particular story that stands out for you of any particular girl or village or family that’s been affected? You’ve obviously impacted thousands, tens of thousands of people and lives. Is the risk that kind of, they just kind of blend in for people that need help as opposed to certain people kind of standing out? Yeah.
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It’s so amazing. I mean there is one which happened recently. It was during the filming of I know we’re going to get to this documentary that we’re producing for Amazon Prime, No Waterland. And the film crew was in this village for three days and they’re disconnected from the charity. They only know about charity from me. So they’re going there. They’re experiencing it for the first time. These are city dwellers, right? They still have all the mod cons even to them. this is like something you read about because why are they ever gonna see it? It’s
Andy & Chris:
Yes.
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so far away. It’s a bit like when Londoners go to Birmingham, we don’t quite get it. So. Um. I like that.
Andy & Chris:
We must apologize for our midget decisions. Yes. Birmingham’s a lovely city.
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We’re gonna cover a little bit. So there was one incident where Soham, the director called me and he said, Shaz, there’s these two sisters here and I know you just want to cover the young girls. But there’s these two sisters here, they’re 80 years old, and they asked us, what are we doing? And we said to them, look, we’re filming about water collection. And it’s at that point they shared that, actually, we’ve been collecting water since we were young girls. Only now, that we physically can’t do that journey, are we retiring from water collection. And he asked them, what else have you done? They said, look, we’ve been wives and mothers, but our role has been. collect water and they said since we’ve been little girls we’ve been walking down this path together
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
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and it’s just so heartbreaking and we’ve got it on video we’ve got it in no water land and I said I absolutely want to cover that because it’s it’s such a poignant reminder that
Andy & Chris:
Hmm?
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a whole lifetime can go collecting water it’s just so ridiculous so for me it was saddening and eye-opening because you never really think that far beyond right? and they were there live telling us that this has been our whole life and in a way two lives wasted.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, a sole purpose was to collect water. Yeah, and like you say, we try and think what that must be like, but you have no comprehension walking up and down a path to the same well or different wells to collect water for most of your life. That’s your purpose. I also think people forget, don’t they, how heavy water is. You know, it’s only when you sort of pick up five liters or 10 liters and you go… Ooh, yeah, that’s actually quite heavy. Yeah. But you’ve then got to put in your head and then walk in 40 degree heat for, I dunno, five miles, six miles, whatever it might be there and back, you know, it’s just mad.
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And this is actually, you’re absolutely right, Chris. This is the reason why I wanted to create this film so we can see it. You know, we don’t need to fly there. We can see it. And there’s scenes in the film, in the documentary where the young girl, I think she’s 12 years old. She puts a pot on her head. And there’s a moment where you just see her face go, hmm, like, you know, like,
Andy & Chris:
Mm,
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it’s really
Andy & Chris:
yeah.
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being strong.
Andy & Chris:
Like when you lift a heavy weight, that moment when it dawns on you what you’ve got.
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Exactly. And especially if you’re a parent, right, you can appreciate how painful that might be to see
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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someone so young doing that. So I’ve tried to show people through the documentary. So it’s not just an idea about people that we’re never going to see,
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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so much poverty around the world. I want people to really be able to feel what
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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they’re going through.
Andy & Chris:
And where did the, where did the idea come from this? Cause it’s the documentary called No Water Land. And as you say, it’s going out on Amazon Prime later on this year. Where did the idea come from it? And what were the challenges that you faced in trying to put together a project like this? Because you live, you live in the UK. You’ve got a great network, but trying to liaise with people who are filming remotely in India. And I know there was a UK into it. How complex was it as a project?
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It’s probably one of the hardest things I’ve ever done in my life. No experience, nothing about the film industry. You don’t know how things are produced. You don’t know how they how they costed. You don’t know that the area areas in which you need to go. Where are you going to film? Are you going to find families? What permissions do you need? It’s it’s been the most challenging thing I’ve ever had to do. And I you know, I related back to to my olden days when I used to design, right? And when the family would come to me and they said, Shaz, we want you to design our wedding invites. It would be so difficult because so much personal passion is involved. It’s such a personal thing. And this project was equally difficult because it wasn’t about producing a piece of work that’s going to make money. It was about me trying to share to the world, especially in the UK, because an Indian… film director doesn’t have the same lens that I do in the UK. So I know what he’s filming is going to have a different reaction over here
Andy & Chris:
Yeah. Hmm.
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that I want. So coordinating that, writing it, rewriting the subtitles in British English, it’s been the hardest thing. And you know how we work in timelines. You give a date and you speak to it here. It’s very normal. You know, Indian timing, you really get to understand what that is as well. So the challenge is…
Andy & Chris:
Is it quite loose?
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It is extremely loose. You know, there was a situation where I was given a date and I turned up, you know, I got my Zoom ready. I was in Turkey on holiday and I got my laptop thinking I’m going to be presented XYZ, you know what we discussed. And he said to me, look, you’re trying to produce something amazing here. You can’t just rush it. I said, no, you’ve given me a date. I’m here. And it was another month from there. So getting accepting delays will happen and it messes your schedule up. So. I’m happy to say there is light at the end of the tunnel.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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And I feel hopefully when you watch it and the world watches it, they get to see that all that effort that goes into creating something like this is absolutely worth it. Some of the cinematography is spectacular. They’ve really done a good job, but
Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.
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it’s hardest thing I’ve ever done.
Andy & Chris:
Brilliant. And is it, without giving too much away, the risk is something like this. It could be quite desperate. It could be quite depressing. It exposes a world that we’re just not familiar to. But your whole outlook and demeanor is about hope. It’s about giving people hope. So is it got a blend of, is it uplifting as well in that we see stories of where lives have been materially changed for the good? as well as highlighting the difficult situation they’re in.
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Absolutely, no one likes a sad film, no one likes a sad ending. It’s all about hope.
Andy & Chris:
I mean,
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It’s…
Andy & Chris:
do the Titanic.
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Yeah, yeah, that’s true, that’s a good example. It’s entirely about hope. Now, what we do is we’re sharing the problem on camera, live,
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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we’ve recorded it all exactly how it is. So it’s been documented, we’re sharing it in a nice way where you can really get into the stories of these individual girls that we interview. And it’s a story of two girls in two completely different villages living the same life. They both have dreams. They’re both young. They’re both smart. But they’re collecting water all day. And we’re trying to show the world that this is two girls in two different villages, but there’s hundreds of thousands of girls like
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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this
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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doing the same thing. So we do share what work the wow has done. And we do ask the girls, you know. What are you doing now? There is an ending where the girls get to pursue a career in the fields that they dream of because of the water wheel.
Andy & Chris:
Okay.
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So it’s not all doom and gloom, it’s quite uplifting.
Andy & Chris:
You have to show the reality then, that’s the thing isn’t it? It’s almost showing the reality that might not make it a depressing, if you know what I mean. That’s the tricky balance to get, isn’t it? Yeah.
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It is, it is very, I mean, when you’re, they film so much footage and you know, as owners of FTA Media, there’s, especially when you’re making a film, they’re not missing anything. There’s like 20 people in the film crew. So much footage. And there’s so many devastating moments in that footage where people are falling over, they’re hurting
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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themselves, there’s arguments in the home, they’ve got no food one day, something, there’s all these catastrophic things happening. but we’ve got to stick to what we’re reporting. So
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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the director said, look, why don’t we put this in? Why don’t we put that in? It shows real life. I was like, it can’t, it’s gotta have a clear focus.
Andy & Chris:
turns into an eight hour documentary, doesn’t it? If you’re not careful.
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People in the UK switch off. It’s just so confusing to
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
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see so
Andy & Chris:
yeah, that’s
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much
Andy & Chris:
right.
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pain. We’re not used to it, right? Our biggest pain point could be a flat tire. And to us, that’s the end of the world. So yeah, it is a fine balance.
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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We were careful about this.
Andy & Chris:
It’s hard, isn’t it? I was reading an article yesterday, it was about a documentary, but it was a film. And there’s a film called The Bridge Too Far, which you young people may not have heard of. But anyway, the film is I think about two and a half hours long. But they said they took the, they filmed the equivalent of 500 hours. Wow. To produce that, you know, and it’s the same sort of thing, isn’t it? You’ve got to find that balance of What do you put in and what don’t you put in and does it tell the story? Does it relate to the stories? You know, it’s not just the film and it’s all the other bits that go with the editing to to produce a Spell binding. Yeah, because as you say shows people just switch off don’t they because it’s sort of like water we turn a
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Yep.
Andy & Chris:
tap
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Yeah, and it’s a bit like the Oxfam adverts. At some point you get desensitized seeing
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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something, you know, so it was a fine balance. And I think one of the keys for this to be a successful project for me, because I’m really happy where it is right now, was when I was holding interviews with the directors. You know when you share something quite sad with someone and you can see their face twitch or change because you’ve really like, they’ve really absorbed the story. and I interviewed three directors and each of them had a different visual response. You know, I was going with a lot of gut here and also their questions. So some of them were just purely black and white. How long do you want it to be? Where do you want
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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it to be? How’s it going to happen? And this director was like, oh, this happened. So what, they can’t go to school. Oh, I can’t imagine, you know, my niece, she’s this age.
Andy & Chris:
He
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And
Andy & Chris:
got the soft stuff.
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yeah. So
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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when he was asking me questions, I was like, this director is going to actually bother to tell the story
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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as it is, rather than just deliver a piece of work, which might not connect, and might be something that I don’t even release.
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah you you you say before exciting. Yeah I’m looking forward to watching it. Yeah, exactly me too. You you say about your daughter And you know kind of the driver behind why you’re doing it and obviously she’s getting older as we all are now she’s a bit older is she starting to Understand and learn more about it from her own point of view as well in there How her upbringing in the UK is so materially different from I know say headpada village in India what her life would have been if she’d have been born in a village like that as opposed to in the UK. Is that starting to dawn on her yet? Or is she still a bit young?
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Yeah, absolutely. Now that she’s six years old and she’s a bit more aware, she’s actually in the documentary because there is a contrast that I’m trying to portray in the documentary of how privileged we are.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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And there’s a scene where I say, does only my child deserve footwear and another must walk barefoot and they show my daughter walking and another walking barefoot. And she knows what’s going on. She turned up for the filming which… Oliver Acton and you Andy kindly and you Chris kindly I donated to the charity because I couldn’t get to India, you know, that’s another story altogether So we did some UK filming and she’s seeing it. She’s a part of it So I’m not constantly talking about it with her, but when I play videos, she’s peering over my shoulder She’s
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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watching I ask her questions, you know a bit a bit quite slow a bit like how I learned design You know, I used to stand behind my elder brothers watch them I’m letting her absorb it, I’m not sitting
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
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her down for lessons and I can see now she’ll ask a question and
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
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what I love is sometimes I’ll overhear her talking with friends, oh my dad’s got a charity and this is what they do and you know it’s really sweet
Andy & Chris:
How
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to hear
Andy & Chris:
cool. That’s
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so I
Andy & Chris:
great. Yeah.
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know it’s happening.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah. That’s great. And you were saying, I mean, you were saying it’s going out on Amazon Prime. What a coup to get it onto one of the major channels like that. That’s incredible.
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Yeah, again, a whole new world for me.
Andy & Chris:
So
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So…
Andy & Chris:
what was it like pitching? Shaz, did you sort of have to, how does that whole process work?
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We went through an agent and the agent said, it’s not gonna happen. Netflix, forget about it, Prime, they’ve just culled hundreds and thousands of shows off their platform to make it high quality. Why don’t you release it on Disney Hotstar? I said, what’s that? We don’t even have that in the UK. And he’s like, no, but they have that in… I was like, no, I need a UK audience to see it. He’s like, no, you can release it on YouTube. I said,
Andy & Chris:
No.
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we’re filming a proper film here. And
Andy & Chris:
It’s not on your iPhone. Yeah.
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he’s managing my expectations. And I thought to myself, okay, worst case scenario is gonna be, I’m gonna have to release it on YouTube, worst case scenario, or some obscure platform that no one in the UK has got access to. So I accepted that. And I told the team that, and we were all a bit disappointed. And even Netflix, for example, Netflix is years of waiting list, and only the top directors get access to Netflix. That was completely out of the question. But the agency I used, they said, look, let’s submit something and let’s see. It’s not like, it’s not gonna happen, but 99.9% of the time you can just forget about it. They’re looking for stuff that’s gonna get viewed a lot. And they pitched it and he called me and he said, Chaz, they have said they’re gonna take it.
Andy & Chris:
Heh.
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And I was like, is that guaranteed? And he’s like, no, there’s a lady in there, and he gave me her name, and he said, she’s watched it, and she was quite touched by it. And the way it’s been filmed, it’s not your typical documentary, which is on the iPhone. I wanted to make it appear like a film, filmed in a film way, to be real. And she really liked it, and she felt the quality of it, because the directors won a lot of awards for his previous work, so
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
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it’s
Andy & Chris:
It’s
Andy & Chris:
got
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really
Andy & Chris:
a bit
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good
Andy & Chris:
of authority
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production.
Andy & Chris:
on it.
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So I said, look, is this a guaranteed yes? And the best way he could put it was, Chad, it’s a bit like when you call the council, you wanna make an extension, you ask them a few questions and they say, most likely we will accept it, but you’re gonna have to put a planning application. So we’re at this stage now
Andy & Chris:
But…
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where we’re going to submit it to them. It could still go barely up, but I feel from the conversations it’s gonna happen.
Andy & Chris:
or
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But
Andy & Chris:
not.
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yeah,
Andy & Chris:
Good, good.
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I was so happy about that. If it happens, I’ll be extremely happy.
Andy & Chris:
To me that sounds like we should be getting some suits for the chemistry on for the week. Yeah I think so. To be honest that sounds good enough. I should write a speech. Strong enough for the speech.
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Cough cough cough
Andy & Chris:
Oh no, that’s very, very exciting. Very exciting.
[email protected]:
Yeah, I’m looking forward to doing a screening in the UK for all our supporters. So that would
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
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be quite
Andy & Chris:
that’d be
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good.
Andy & Chris:
interesting. That’d be really
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
cool. What we’ll do as well is if we put in the show notes, we’ll add in the links to the charity. Just because like you said, I know, you know, charity works and donations and I think you’ve managed to try and I don’t know how you’ve done it, but you’ve kept your kind of figure at 28 pounds per wheel. So people can make donations, but for you, I know it’s as much about education, informing people and just highlighting what’s going on. So people can jump on the link to find out a bit more about the charity. That would be good as well. Hmm.
[email protected]:
Absolutely, the more people that know about it, they don’t, you know, for me a donation is also you just sharing it in a family WhatsApp group,
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
[email protected]:
you’re posting on social media. For me, for me, that’s equally powerful to donating £28. So we’ve got people who donate, never seen them in my life, you know, a significant sum, several thousand pounds, and then you’ve got people who talk about it all the time and each of those are equally important for a charity to do its work.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, definitely. Get it out there, that’s brilliant. What’s next for it? What direction are you going in now? So it’s established, you’ve got the network on the ground, wheels are being delivered, you’ve got the documentary. Is there another chapter to the same book coming?
[email protected]:
It’s a bit like a business, obviously this is not for profit, but it’s a bit like a business, you
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
keep refining it. So right now our process is we send Narayan, one of our ground team guys, to the village to assess it. Now if this village is remote, he spent a day travelling, day there, we lose contact with him sometimes so each time we think, is he alright? And then he appears, he’s a really resilient
Andy & Chris:
Pfft.
[email protected]:
guy. So he will knock on doors, assess how many families, see if it’s a suitable village, and nearly every time it is a suitable village. So it takes a few days, then we plan it, then we deliver those wheels. This whole process takes so much time. So
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
[email protected]:
now I’m thinking to cut out that survey altogether. We go with X number of wheels to the village that we’ve heard about, and we just do it live on the day delivered, saving an earlier trip, which means… Overall, we can do more delivery. So I’m just trying to refine it like
Andy & Chris:
Hmm. Hmm.
[email protected]:
I’m refining Digimax, where you’ve refined Frank Taylor
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
over 20 years. It’s a bit like that, those little 1%s which accumulate.
Andy & Chris:
I can’t imagine anyone’s going to turn one down, can you? No. If you’ve got a village that hasn’t got a water supply that needs to go to it, they’re probably going to go, yeah, that’d be great. Yes. And even if you end up in a scenario where with that model, there’s a potential risk that you deliver to a village that was perhaps not as needed or in such a hard position as another village. But if you look at it over an overall project, if that means that by not doing the inspection, The downside to that is that wanting 20 deliveries might not have ended up in the perfect village. You’ve still had a massive gain. You’ve still done the deliveries. Because you’ve got more wheels with more people. And there’s
[email protected]:
district.
Andy & Chris:
always going to be somebody who’s in a more desperate situation than somebody else. But if you can just keep helping people in greater numbers, that’s a great thing.
[email protected]:
Absolutely. I think the challenge is also how many wheels do you take? Like I said to you, it’s
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
very difficult to get to these places. So if it’s a village that needs 150 wheels, there has been a time where they had 60 to deliver because we’d run out of stock and the factory wasn’t making it fast enough. The team had to make an escape because they were getting mobbed. If you can imagine, hundreds of people surrounding you because there’s families of five, six, seven. And… He said, before we knew it, so many crowds built up and there were shouting, screaming, cause they don’t know that we’re gonna come back with more. You
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
know, they don’t know, cause they’re always getting let down with lies also.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
And he said, Ajay said to me, we were actually afraid for our life and I’m never doing this again, send someone else. Like it was, he was that shaken
Andy & Chris:
Wow.
[email protected]:
up by it.
Andy & Chris:
Man, man. Geez.
[email protected]:
I mean, obviously I convinced him with another motivational talk, so he’s still with us. Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Your your powers and motivation across the world and security.
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah But it shows it’s it’s always good to catch up and I think the update is great honestly But I said congratulations for the documentary. It sounds like it wasn’t easy But what a what a process to go through and a learning experience for you
[email protected]:
Absolutely, thank you very much for having me on the show and you know I also want to thank Oliver, Drew, you for you know when I was I was meant to go to India to film my part
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
[email protected]:
and I and I said and this is important I get this out there I didn’t want to be in the documentary because I don’t feel this is about me and I’m also I also prefer to be behind the scenes and the director said Shaz, if you’re not in it, we’ve got no documentary, because there’s enough content out there talking about hardships, but people need to know why you’re doing this. So eventually when I agreed to being on camera, and Sanjay Kapoor, he’s a Bollywood star, he’s a friend,
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
and he’s also an ambassador, he said Shaz, he’s absolutely right, you’ve got to be in it. So I said fine, I’m going to fly to India and do this. And my visa got rejected. and I had an interview with the Indian Embassy and it was a really humiliating experience. He said, have you got links to Pakistan? And I said, yeah, my dad was born in pre-Pakistan India, and then he moved after the partition. So I said, not really. And he was like, you do have a link and you’ve not been honest in your form. I said, how’s that link? And he said, you are connected. I was like, okay, technically, yeah. But okay, how do we move on from here? I’m rejecting your visa. and they hold your passport for three months. And all
Andy & Chris:
Oh
[email protected]:
that
Andy & Chris:
wow.
[email protected]:
bureaucracy and all this politics, I’m sure it’s happening on both sides. It was disheartening, especially since it was a trip for the charity.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
So when I shared this with you, Andy, and you’ll remember this clearly, you said, don’t worry, we’re going to film it for you and we’re going to film here. And obviously it was a blessing in disguise because… how comfortable I was able to get on camera because of Oliver’s approach and the set, et cetera. I may not have gotten that with unknown people in another country.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, it’s funny how things turn out.
[email protected]:
Yeah, it is. I’m so happy this actually happened. So yeah.
Andy & Chris:
But also arguably it potentially might be a richer documentary by actually showing a Western setting and a Western experience with the desperate poverty of villages in India. You know, you get that visual juxtaposition between the two, whereas if you’d have been out there and it had all been Indian based, you wouldn’t have had that crossover.
[email protected]:
Absolutely, and I wouldn’t be able to get my daughter into the documentary
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
as well
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
to show that look, I am a father, there’s
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
a reason behind this. So it all had a happy ending, but it really did come down to me being with a comfortable video crew who knew what they’re doing. And Oliver pulled out all the stops, he chose a location, I just had to turn up. And so I just want to say thank you to FTA Media and you for
Andy & Chris:
I
[email protected]:
that
Andy & Chris:
appreciate
[email protected]:
support.
Andy & Chris:
it. I appreciate it. Looking forward to coming to the screening of it. Yeah, it’ll be exciting. Yeah. Even though you’re returning guests, you don’t get away scot-free. You still need to answer our two questions because that would mean that we’d… It’ll be our first of not asking these questions that we didn’t ask you. So we will. So the first one is if you could be a fly on a wall in this situation. A bit of a roundabout, I imagine. Yeah, that’s a long run-up. That was a long run-up. Yeah, that’s right.
[email protected]:
I don’t
Andy & Chris:
So
[email protected]:
like these questions,
Andy & Chris:
if…
[email protected]:
what is it? What did you say?
Andy & Chris:
I know what’s going to happen. So if you could be a fly on the wall in a situation, where would you be and who would that be with if you were given the opportunity? Doesn’t need to be related to the charity, just a situation. Where would you like to be?
[email protected]:
Okay, this is a really good question. You know, the UK dentistry is so toxic and sometimes, you know, it takes years to develop real true friendships like you and I have got. I would love to be in a room, you know, which I’ve entered and then I leave and just see how people speak about me because you
Andy & Chris:
I can
[email protected]:
don’t…
Andy & Chris:
tell
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
you I can tell you yours leave early. Do you wanna know?
[email protected]:
Yeah. Yeah. Because that tells you what people are like You
Andy & Chris:
Yeah
[email protected]:
know, it’s amazing what people will say. And you know, if they’re saying good things, for
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
me, reputation and how I am, and for me to be perceived correctly is important. So I’d love to hear, because people always say to me, oh, Shaz, everyone says nice things about you. You never hear it. I would love to hear what is exactly said.
Andy & Chris:
Next event.
[email protected]:
That would be interesting.
Andy & Chris:
Next event we’re at. We’re writing them down for you on my phone.
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
And I’ll give it feedback when next out for dinner. I
[email protected]:
I’m
Andy & Chris:
tell
[email protected]:
sorry.
Andy & Chris:
you that you actually started this and I think the closest I’ve ever seen it being lived out in real life was when we did the episode with Munis Iqbal. And Munis was quite nervous about coming on and being a guest. So we recorded it and it went out. And when the episode went live, you posted a link on Facebook and said, Munis is a really good guy. this is what he’s done for me. Has anybody else got any other stories or experience of how Moonis has helped them? And there were 60 or 70 comments of people saying things, you know, directly to Moonis where he’d helped out and where he’d helped. And I guess it’s that kind of thing where he got to hear the things that quite often people only hear once they’re dead. I was gonna say, it’s a bit like, would you want to be at your own funeral to see one who turned up and two if they said nice things about you?
[email protected]:
He was moved by that because we all got to see because I’m
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
only seeing what he’s done for me like He said oh let’s meet up He didn’t tell me he’s driving two and a half hours to see me after a
Andy & Chris:
Yeah,
[email protected]:
clinic
Andy & Chris:
yeah,
[email protected]:
day and then
Andy & Chris:
yeah,
[email protected]:
two and a
Andy & Chris:
yeah.
[email protected]:
half hours back It’s only when I probed where are you coming from? So he’s doing lots of things for people in lots of different scenarios And there’s like 60 people saying moon is did this for me did this
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
for me? And he he was he was really moved. So was his family because he showed his mom I think
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
I guess, yeah, it’s similar in that way because, you know, for me, business is important, but not from a financial perspective. It’s from an impact perspective. And now the charity allows me to do that in a more
Andy & Chris:
Hmm.
[email protected]:
old sense. You never really know, are you doing it right? Because it’s all new. Charity is new, documentary is new. I’m learning on the job. It’s not
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
20 years of business learning. I’m going to make mistakes.
Andy & Chris:
there. That’s good. That’s good. And our last question is, if you can meet somebody who would you like to meet given the opportunity?
[email protected]:
Um, alive or dead?
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, either. So both.
[email protected]:
Either.
Andy & Chris:
Both.
[email protected]:
Either.
Andy & Chris:
It’s an exact moment as the bus hits them. You start as they’re alive and then you’ve met them. Yeah, and you can even go, you can either go a real personal fictional. Yeah, whatever,
[email protected]:
Yeah.
Andy & Chris:
whatever takes your fancy.
[email protected]:
So, Delilahmah, no, I’m joking. Steve Jobs. Steve Jobs has been a huge inspiration for me.
Andy & Chris:
Mm.
[email protected]:
I say to the team when they come to me with an idea or even if I’m presenting an idea, what would Steve Jobs do? You
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
know, it’s so difficult to simplify the complicated. Simplicity is harder to design than something complicated with lots of bells and whistles. If you apply that concept to business, which I’ve tried to do in Digimax and every avenue of it, I just feel like this man was able to change the world. What
Andy & Chris:
Mmm.
[email protected]:
must his mind be like? And I think many entrepreneurs, including yourself, you’d be able to relate to this. Wouldn’t you love to talk to him and ask him questions about things that we struggle with and
Andy & Chris:
Yeah.
[email protected]:
how do you come up with these ideas and how do you deal with people holding back and saying you can’t do it? Because he’s achieved… so much. It’s
Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.
[email protected]:
not a tech company, it’s a lifestyle company because we can’t live without these products. So yeah, it would be Steve Jobs.
Andy & Chris:
Yeah, that’s a good one. Interesting. Very good one. Chas, thank you. As always. It’s been so much fun. It always is. It always is. And like I say, I wish you all the luck in the world when the documentary comes out.
[email protected]:
Thank you very much.
Andy & Chris:
Genuinely
[email protected]:
Thank
Andy & Chris:
looking
[email protected]:
you
Andy & Chris:
forward
[email protected]:
for the
Andy & Chris:
to
[email protected]:
support.
Andy & Chris:
seeing it. Yeah, definitely. So genuinely looking forward to seeing it. And I’m sure people say a lot from this. But if you could let us have the links, we’ll definitely drop those in the show notes so people can have a little click around and find out a bit more about
[email protected]:
Wonderful
Andy & Chris:
the charity.
[email protected]:
and you guys are doing a great job. Thank you for bringing this to dentistry because
Andy & Chris:
Not at
[email protected]:
I don’t
Andy & Chris:
all.
[email protected]:
think there’s any podcasts out there like this So I want to see continue to go from strength to strength. Well done
Andy & Chris:
Thank you very much and just remember everybody’s 28 pounds 28 pounds for a wheel
[email protected]:
Yes.
Andy & Chris:
exactly exactly lovely cheers Cheers
[email protected]:
Thank you. Take
Andy & Chris:
to
[email protected]:
care.
Andy & Chris:
the culture though
[email protected]:
Bye.
