Dentology Podcast with Suzy Rowlands

Transcript – Dentology Podcast with Suzy Rowlands

Episode Release Date: Monday 7 August 2023

Andy & Chris:
Yet again, it’s exciting guest time. Another podcast with another great guest that we have known for a good long time. And I’m so looking forward to it. So today we are very fortunate. We have Suzy Rowlands joining us and Suzy is the Executive Administrator for the British Association of Cosmetic Dentistry, the BACD, but also the BAPD, the BADT, but more importantly a positive force in dentistry. Yeah, definitely. Welcome Suzy, how are you? Hello.

Suzy Rowlands:
Hi lady traps, I’m fine thank you, nice to see you.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, you too, you too. As you said that, it’s hard to think, I think it probably must be coming up for close on 20 years that we’ve known

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s

Andy & Chris:
you.

Suzy Rowlands:
the

Andy & Chris:
Harder

Suzy Rowlands:
20th

Andy & Chris:
thought.

Suzy Rowlands:
conference next year. And so we missed in 2020 because

Andy & Chris:
Wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
of COVID

Andy & Chris:
As we all did.

Suzy Rowlands:
as

Andy & Chris:
Where

Suzy Rowlands:
we all did.

Andy & Chris:
was the

Suzy Rowlands:
So

Andy & Chris:
first one, Sisy? Where was the first one? Can

Suzy Rowlands:
the

Andy & Chris:
you remember?

Suzy Rowlands:
first one was November, 2004, which was in London. And part of the reason that they are in November is because the then book, I started in February, 2005 because I was in a job. that I gave my notice in, but I had a prior commitment at the same time as the conference that I couldn’t get out of. It was a thing at the Chilean embassy and I couldn’t not do it. I didn’t want to be hauled across and dragged into exile somewhere. So

Andy & Chris:
No, that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
I

Andy & Chris:
probably very true.

Suzy Rowlands:
had to do this event, but they got it together quite quickly and they did it in, yeah, they did it in, it was the Selfridges Hotel, you know where that…

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
It

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
used to be,

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
you know what I mean, it’s not there anymore. It’s the one that’s,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s your side entrance.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
But it was in the Selfridges Hotel and apparently it was absolutely amazing, but I couldn’t go. So they had speakers, the AACD, the American Academy, helped

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
enormously and sent a lot of speakers over. Yeah, and then it just took off from there basically. Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
Wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
so that

Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
was

Andy & Chris:
So

Suzy Rowlands:
it.

Andy & Chris:
what it became it was November because you weren’t available

Suzy Rowlands:
It was

Andy & Chris:
or

Suzy Rowlands:
November

Andy & Chris:
something

Suzy Rowlands:
because that was the earliest they could manage to get everything together. And it’s as good a month as any, isn’t it? I mean, you know what it’s like. June is always a nightmare for meetings. September’s

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
kind of too close to coming back after the

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
school year.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And then there’s so many other things going on across the year that you

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
might as well stick with what you know.

Andy & Chris:
And I suppose you’d have avoided, wouldn’t the old, whatever it was, not BDTA Showcase was October.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
that was

Andy & Chris:
Wasn’t

Suzy Rowlands:
October,

Andy & Chris:
it, say

Suzy Rowlands:
wasn’t it? And

Andy & Chris:
it,

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
have

Andy & Chris:
that’s it.

Suzy Rowlands:
to

Andy & Chris:
But

Suzy Rowlands:
be

Andy & Chris:
it’s always

Suzy Rowlands:
careful.

Andy & Chris:
a nice run up to the, it’s a nice run up for the party season, isn’t it? Because you always like to

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
have

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
a little

Suzy Rowlands:
have

Andy & Chris:
party

Suzy Rowlands:
to be careful

Andy & Chris:
at the end of

Suzy Rowlands:
of avoiding

Andy & Chris:
conference.

Suzy Rowlands:
Thanksgiving if you’ve got US speakers

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
as well.

Andy & Chris:
Yes.

Suzy Rowlands:
And you know there are so many variables, aren’t there?

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, brilliant. There we are. But before we get to your dental career, let’s

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
roll back and try and dig into who Suzy Roden’s is. So

Suzy Rowlands:
Hehehe

Andy & Chris:
take us back into your childhood and give us a sense of understanding why you become so successful. What was your childhood like?

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh,

Andy & Chris:
Where was

Suzy Rowlands:
lovely.

Andy & Chris:
that? Where were you brought

Suzy Rowlands:
So

Andy & Chris:
up?

Suzy Rowlands:
I was brought up in a place called Hadnall, which is north of Shrewsbury, and lived in the same place my whole life. My mother was, I’m adopted, you know that’s not a big secret.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
I know some people are paranoid about not finding out, but I was always told from an early age, to the point

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
where I was told that I was chosen and everyone else, you know, got stuck with their children or their parents until one day at school, my My father, after he walked down to get me from this primary school, walked down to get me and he said, he always called me Cariad, which is he was Welsh, and he said, which means darling, he said, you’ve been telling everyone that you’re much better than them, haven’t you, that you’re a little princess. He said, now we all know that you are, but you can’t keep saying it all the time at school, so you have to stop. So, yeah.

Andy & Chris:
I will, I will.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah. So I didn’t know I had an extraordinarily happy childhood. You know what that was like. I’m 60, I’m 61 this year. And it was different. I would walk down the road to school and I would be collected usually on the way back. My mother came from a big farming family, so she was brought up nearby. My father, he was the youngest of three brothers and his oldest brother, my Uncle David, was the vicar in Hadnall. When my father came back from the war, both his parents had died fairly young. His father, he was born on Anglesey and his father was a judge. But they both died in their early 50s of

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
heart

Andy & Chris:
wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
attacks, I think. And so he had nowhere to go when he came back.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
Nowhere to live. He had no family, nothing. No home. So he

Andy & Chris:
Well.

Suzy Rowlands:
moved to live with his brother and then he met my mother. That was that.

Andy & Chris:
No, I won’t.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah, so but now I had an extraordinarily happy childhood when I did I know people look back with you know Rose-tinted glasses, but I did I was

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
you know, I was a happy child I was I had lots of love and affection big family around my mother was the youngest. She had four older brothers So she was very spoiled. My mother

Andy & Chris:
Hahaha

Suzy Rowlands:
had a big age gap in my mother’s family So she was the youngest her oldest brother was 18 years older than her So she

Andy & Chris:
Oh, what?

Suzy Rowlands:
was at prep school with her nephew.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah. Wow,

Suzy Rowlands:
I have

Andy & Chris:
why

Suzy Rowlands:
a photograph

Andy & Chris:
you guys have…

Suzy Rowlands:
of her when her older brother got married in the 1920s, and she’s dressed like a little tiny flapper as a bridesmaid with a little hat on, a little fringe dress,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, flip,

Suzy Rowlands:
very sweet. Yeah, so it was.

Andy & Chris:
flip. So did you have any siblings? Or were you an only child, or were there any siblings

Suzy Rowlands:
No, I have

Andy & Chris:
in

Suzy Rowlands:
a younger

Andy & Chris:
there with

Suzy Rowlands:
brother,

Andy & Chris:
you?

Suzy Rowlands:
so he’s three years younger than me, Richard, and he was

Andy & Chris:
Bye.

Suzy Rowlands:
adopted as well. So he lives locally, he lives in South Shropshire in a place called Monford Bridge, which is just outside Shrewsbury.

Andy & Chris:
Right, yeah, which is still your sitting neck of the woods, aren’t you?

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, we are. So I moved to London after university, but then

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
my husband is from Shropshire as well and we had always intended to move back and we did.

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
So we moved back in May 2018 and it’s fantastic. We love it.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah, I know that you were charting your renovation of your house online.

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh

Andy & Chris:
It

Suzy Rowlands:
yes.

Andy & Chris:
was fascinating to see all the work you haven’t done.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, you’ll be amazed to know that there’s still some snagging to be done, Steve the Builder. Yeah, there’s

Andy & Chris:
There

Suzy Rowlands:
always snagging,

Andy & Chris:
is.

Suzy Rowlands:
isn’t there?

Andy & Chris:
Yeah. So you finish your schooling

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
and then what was there an intervening period between then and you then having your first friary into the world of dentistry? Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, I mean, I, my first, I started, I moved to London after university and I did a, I, my father said to me, if you can type, you’ll always have a job. He said you

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
might not use it, but he said if you can type, and he could type, he was a pharmacist.

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
So I have no idea

Andy & Chris:
Okay.

Suzy Rowlands:
where or when he learned to type, but he could. And I started off working as a temp and I worked in quite a few law firms. And one of them was, I mean, I had various, you know, bits and pieces of

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
temping jobs,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
which you do.

Andy & Chris:
What was your degree in, Susie?

Suzy Rowlands:
Business studies, which is a suitable

Andy & Chris:
Ah, okay, right,

Suzy Rowlands:
title,

Andy & Chris:
right.

Suzy Rowlands:
but it just

Andy & Chris:
Yep.

Suzy Rowlands:
means that it’s sort of like an admin type degree, which

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
has come in handy, but

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
say

Suzy Rowlands:
didn’t

Andy & Chris:
that.

Suzy Rowlands:
teach you how to type.

Andy & Chris:
Ha ha ha.

Suzy Rowlands:
And certainly being a law secretary, if you go into working as a legal secretary, you learn to type extraordinarily fast.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
So I worked primarily in… IP, intellectual property litigation. And I ended up at a firm on the Aldwych called Baker and Mackenzie, who at the time, remember this was in the 80s, at the time they were the biggest law firm in the world. They were based in Chicago, but the office in London wasn’t huge. I think it’s done one of those big merges now, but they had an office on the Aldwych, which was marvelous, just behind

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
Covent Garden.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, lovely.

Suzy Rowlands:
I ended up in there as a temp, and then they They kept me on as a floating tent. So I floated from department to department.

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
And then I ended up in the IP litigation department. So we did trademarking mostly for companies like Chappachaps, you know, those lollipops,

Andy & Chris:
Ah, yeah, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Louis Vuitton, watches of Switzerland. I can spot a fake handbag and a fake watch still

Andy & Chris:
Hahaha

Suzy Rowlands:
from miles away. It was a good education. We had a safe. full of actual real watches, you know, you name a watch, we had a real one in there, see? But that’s

Andy & Chris:
I will.

Suzy Rowlands:
where I kind of learned to think on my feet because you’d often have council phoning you in a massive panic one morning saying, I’m going to call you in half an hour. And they’d hurl all this stuff down the phone at you or they’d courier around, you know, a little cassette tape, which you didn’t have to transcribe. And you could not make any errors. You absolutely could not make any errors

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
at all. So

Andy & Chris:
But-

Suzy Rowlands:
I can still type at about 100 words a minute with no mistakes.

Andy & Chris:
A great transferable skill as well.

Suzy Rowlands:
massively say massively

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, definitely.

Suzy Rowlands:
say.

Andy & Chris:
So was the draw for a girl from Shropshire to

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
come to the bright lights of London, was that the excitement of getting drawn

Suzy Rowlands:
I mean,

Andy & Chris:
into the

Suzy Rowlands:
that

Andy & Chris:
big city?

Suzy Rowlands:
everybody moved. They just did, you know, all my school

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
friends did. I mean, we had

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
a, I went to a private day school in Shrewsbury, Shrewsbury High School for girls. And we had, my year, it was 30, there were two classes, there were 30 in each class. And that sounds small, 60 in a year. But for us, that was quite a big year. That was the biggest intake they’d had. And Most of us, most of us moved away. Most of us went to London because you were expected to go to university. You didn’t not

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
go to university. You stayed on a few people, I think out of our whole year, I think possibly six people stayed on to do Oxbridge, which you did then, you did an extra term.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
So you would have done, you stayed on. So you had the upper, the middle, you had the lower, the middle and the upper six. So you had the upper six was the year. when everyone said, you stayed on, you stayed on.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
But most of us left and went off to do various things. And yes, I partly moved out to London because I wanted to do this post-grad typing thing anyway, and that was the

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
best place to do it. And of course you could do it, you got student grants in those days. And you could get grants, couldn’t you? You could get grants to just keep

Andy & Chris:
That’s

Suzy Rowlands:
going

Andy & Chris:
true, yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
basically,

Andy & Chris:
that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
couldn’t

Andy & Chris:
true. You

Suzy Rowlands:
you?

Andy & Chris:
forget

Suzy Rowlands:
I mean, you

Andy & Chris:
about

Suzy Rowlands:
could

Andy & Chris:
that,

Suzy Rowlands:
do

Andy & Chris:
don’t

Suzy Rowlands:
maths,

Andy & Chris:
you? Yeah, that

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
is

Suzy Rowlands:
could

Andy & Chris:
true,

Suzy Rowlands:
do

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
all sorts of stuff. and they would pay you. And because my father was by then retired, I got a full grant. So I was quite happy about that,

Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
as was he.

Andy & Chris:
I’m sure there’s lots of people listening to this thinking, you were paid to learn? What’s a grant?

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, but you

Andy & Chris:
You

Suzy Rowlands:
were,

Andy & Chris:
were given

Suzy Rowlands:
weren’t

Andy & Chris:
money

Suzy Rowlands:
you?

Andy & Chris:
to learn?

Suzy Rowlands:
And it was in those days, you didn’t need a degree, but it was much better to have one, wasn’t it?

Andy & Chris:
Mmm. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
Where did you live when you came down?

Suzy Rowlands:
I started off living just over Hammersmith Bridge in Castle now. So I hadn’t

Andy & Chris:
Ah, okay.

Suzy Rowlands:
found anywhere to live. And my mother came down with me to sort of make sure that I was, you know, I had to come and do the exam to get in and then I had to come and fill in millions of forms. And there was a lady in the office called Alison who took in lodgers. And so my mother said, Oh, why don’t you stay? So I did. And it was lovely. So it was. So you go over Hammersmith Bridge, I know you can’t anymore, but it was on the left, there’s a big Castle Noir mansion, huge set of mansion blocks, and she lived there. And

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
she

Andy & Chris:
don’t

Suzy Rowlands:
took

Andy & Chris:
know.

Suzy Rowlands:
in lodgers, just one lodger. Her husband worked on oil rigs, so he was away quite a lot. And she had a lovely little boy called Jack, so I could babysit him, and

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
it was nice. So I liked that side of London, so I could just walk in over the bridge, and it’s

Andy & Chris:
That’s

Suzy Rowlands:
nice.

Andy & Chris:
an easily commutable, isn’t it?

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
very

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
easy to mutable,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
isn’t it? Although now I think Hammersmith Bridges close, isn’t it, to traffic anyway.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Because it was always quite fragile, even

Andy & Chris:
That’s

Suzy Rowlands:
then.

Andy & Chris:
right. It might fall down. Yeah. So then.

Suzy Rowlands:
And they can’t do much about, they have to close it to fix it, don’t they?

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah. So then to jump forward, I know that in 1995 you

Suzy Rowlands:
Mm.

Andy & Chris:
worked at the FDI, the World Dental Federation.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
So what was the kind of the segue from doing IP for Chubba Chups and

Suzy Rowlands:
Right,

Andy & Chris:
Louis Vuitton

Suzy Rowlands:
so in between that,

Andy & Chris:
to then ended up in dentistry? Was it

Suzy Rowlands:
well in

Andy & Chris:
a

Suzy Rowlands:
between

Andy & Chris:
hop, skip

Suzy Rowlands:
that,

Andy & Chris:
and a jump?

Suzy Rowlands:
after I stopped doing law, so what happened was my boss at the time, the partner I worked for, he was headhunted by a firm called Herbert Smith,

Andy & Chris:
Oh, big

Suzy Rowlands:
who

Andy & Chris:
firm,

Suzy Rowlands:
at

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
the time, they were known at the time as very aggressive litigators.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And the thing to do then was you usually took your secretary, you took your assistant with you. part of the deal that

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
wasn’t at all uncommon. So James

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
and I moved to Herbert Smith and we absolutely hated it. They were just all about the money. I’m not saying

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
that Baker and McKenzie were, but they were very aggressive and they were very, don’t know, it just wasn’t a very, it wasn’t an unpleasant place to work, but

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
they just didn’t have the friendly atmosphere of Baker and McKenzie.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
So James

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
ended up

Andy & Chris:
right.

Suzy Rowlands:
going back to Yorkshire, which was where he was originally from and he set up on his own. I lost touch with him. and I was scouting through the cremes de la creme looking for jobs. And I saw this one advertised saying small publishing firm. I don’t even think it said dental. Anyway, off I went to the interview in Soho, and it was the FDI, and then I still wasn’t entirely sure what I was supposed to be doing. So they interviewed me, and then they phoned me about a week later and offered me the job. So in I went, and I started on the 1st of June, 1995, It was still a complete mystery to me how everything worked until

Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
I went to a conference. So the first conference was September that year in Hong Kong because one of the things they said to me at the interview was the way they phrased it, they said, oh, you’ll have to go to Hong Kong in September. And I said, okay.

Andy & Chris:
What a shame, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Terrible. So off I trotted. And until you see, it’s like trying to explain. because they have two separate parts. They have the scientific part, you know, like the

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
BACD does. And then they

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
also have the council meetings and all the committee meetings and stuff.

Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
So I was in that area to start with. So I was the, the executive director had two assistants, myself and a lady called Margaret, who I’m still in touch with, she’d long ago retired. And we did that part, but you’re literally chucked in at the deep end. You really are.

Andy & Chris:
Well,

Suzy Rowlands:
But until

Andy & Chris:
well.

Suzy Rowlands:
you see a conference in action, It’s difficult to explain it to somebody. You can look at it all you like on paper.

Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s like when we have the students coming to our events. They

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
don’t quite know what to expect, do they? And for us,

Andy & Chris:
Hehehe

Suzy Rowlands:
all three of us, we know exactly what happens at a dental show, don’t we? Or it’s an admission

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
or a meeting.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
But to someone who’s never been to an event, they have no idea.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s a whole different thing. But once you’re there… Yeah, and

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
it was great. I loved it there because it was quite a small, I mean, there weren’t that many staff. I think there were about 20 of us. But with those large, huge meetings, I mean, you know, tens of thousands of meetings,

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
you, they’re booked years in advance, five or six

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
years in advance, and you have an on the ground team.

Andy & Chris:
Right, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah. So following Hong Kong, that job also took you to France, where

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
you

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
then

Suzy Rowlands:
so,

Andy & Chris:
stayed for a period of time.

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah, so what happened was

Andy & Chris:
Hahaha

Suzy Rowlands:
the lease on the office, we were in an office in Soho next to Private Eye, it was marvelous. They would pop in mid afternoon to collect their post and lurch off to wherever they lurch off to, they were very friendly. But it was a tight, it was it was a tall, thin building, and we were growing out of it, and the lease was running out. Now there will never be an FDI, World Dental Federation Conference in the UK, there’s nowhere near big enough. You know, I did a conference in Orlando for 60,000 dentists. So,

Andy & Chris:
Oh my goodness.

Suzy Rowlands:
which is great. Yes, marvelous.

Andy & Chris:
Wow, that’s amazing, isn’t it?

Suzy Rowlands:
A lot of dentists.

Andy & Chris:
I mean,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah, a lot

Andy & Chris:
that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
of dentists.

Andy & Chris:
a huge amount of dentists.

Suzy Rowlands:
So, but their average size is probably 15 to 20,000. So

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
there’s nowhere anywhere near large enough. So,

Andy & Chris:
No.

Suzy Rowlands:
They started casting about and I can remember saying, my boss was this lovely, lovely Swedish dentist called Peroka Zillane. And we went to look at Centrepoint and that was marvelous going up there. We went right up to the top and you could look

Andy & Chris:
Oh wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
down and see all the roof. There’s so many people have roof gardens that you obviously

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
you can’t see unless you’re right up at the top, can you? So then we looked and we looked and then we thought, well, we don’t need to be in the UK. Anyway, this all panned out. to us to just move into France. So they announced this and I think it was certainly a way of culling the office because by the time they’d finished they were like three of us left I think. So and obviously and I said first of all I said well I can’t you know what’s my husband going to do? We’ll give him a job, we’ll give him a job. So I spoke to him and he said oh yes I can go skiing at lunchtime. So that was yeah that was it. So they put him in charge they put him in the congress department

Andy & Chris:
It

Suzy Rowlands:
and

Andy & Chris:
was

Suzy Rowlands:
because

Andy & Chris:
easy

Suzy Rowlands:
he’s

Andy & Chris:
to keep Rhys happy. Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
having

Andy & Chris:
he was fine.

Suzy Rowlands:
a race He used to work in logistics, so he used to work for LEP a long time ago, so that’s why he does everything for the conference in terms

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
of exhibition, because he knows what to do. So off we went, but we were in a place called Fennez Voltaire, which my husband described as the Huddersfield of France. Sorry to all those people who live in Huddersfield, but really it wasn’t the prettiest place you’ve ever seen, it’s fair to say. And it was right on the border with Switzerland, literally. You could see

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
that if you… trained your head far enough, you could see the border. And where we lived, a little village, it was 95% non-French because CERN was there and we were in the big loop.

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
CERN.

Andy & Chris:
okay.

Suzy Rowlands:
So in our block, there were all nuclear physicists. I’m not making

Andy & Chris:
International

Suzy Rowlands:
this up, I promise

Andy & Chris:
scientists,

Suzy Rowlands:
you.

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
There were Russians, there were Japanese, there were Australians, there were Canadians, there were every nationality known to man. And…

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
what they really should have done was moved to Switzerland as an NGO, which they have done since.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
But it was it was fine. It was a big culture shock because living

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
in France is completely different than visiting France because it is closed most of the time, it’s fair to say. And it’s not we want you know, you’re not in a sort of beautiful scenic area. Well, we were the

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
by the

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Jura and we were about 40 minutes from the tunnel. So we could easily go, you’d often go into Geneva to get lunch because the food was

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
better. The food was

Andy & Chris:
Uh,

Suzy Rowlands:
better.

Andy & Chris:
okay.

Suzy Rowlands:
Your choice of sandwich was either ham, cheese, cheese and ham, ham and cheese. Very occasionally

Andy & Chris:
Hehehe

Suzy Rowlands:
you get tuna or on a very rare occasion you get salami and that

Andy & Chris:
Well,

Suzy Rowlands:
was it. So if you

Andy & Chris:
wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
went to the airport, so we were really close to the airport, so you’d go through the border control, you’d go through the border controls all the time. You’d sometimes go accidentally if you weren’t looking where you were going around about because there was so many border controls where we lived.

Andy & Chris:
Ha ha ha.

Suzy Rowlands:
But it was very, it was quite hard to find somewhere to live because obviously Switzerland is insanely expensive. So most people who work in Switzerland often live in France because it’s cheaper. Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
Right. Are you quite impulsive, Susie? You cite me as somebody who finds it quite easy to say yes to things based on how you recount in

Suzy Rowlands:
I

Andy & Chris:
your

Suzy Rowlands:
kind

Andy & Chris:
life

Suzy Rowlands:
of

Andy & Chris:
so far.

Suzy Rowlands:
am. I kind of am. And it was a bit sort of, you know, my French was kind of like A level French. And in fact, A level French is not much different than O level French. All you do is

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
you study,

Andy & Chris:
true.

Suzy Rowlands:
you study, you know, and it’s like you study more complicated set text and you know, you, I did the same set text for French and for ancient Greek as well, which was a bit weird.

Andy & Chris:
You

Suzy Rowlands:
But

Andy & Chris:
can’t

Suzy Rowlands:
we…

Andy & Chris:
work in the pen of my auntie into many conversations.

Suzy Rowlands:
Exactly,

Andy & Chris:
Or the cat sat on the table.

Suzy Rowlands:
exactly. Yeah. So it was and also, you know, we got by, my French was good enough to get by, both of us were, but everybody spoke extraordinarily good English, they just did.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
And so it was, no, I mean, I’m not, but I just thought it would be stupid to say no. And I thought, what have I got to lose? You know, we knew that we wouldn’t stay there for probably

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
longer than about 18 months, which we didn’t.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And yeah, it was a learning experience and it was interesting because you could… We did lots and lots of driving around. My mother used to come and stay all the time because she loved it because you could easily… You know, Switzerland is very, very beautiful.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
It is a really beautiful place. And Geneva, whilst being quite boring and super expensive, is very pretty around the…

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
You know, you can…

Andy & Chris:
Especially

Suzy Rowlands:
The

Andy & Chris:
on the like.

Suzy Rowlands:
lake, the Lac Lemont, and it’s just very pretty. And as I said, we were close to the Jura. We were close to… We could easily go into Italy. You know, it wasn’t

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
far at all to go into Italy. You go through the tunnel and pop out in Aosta on the other side. And

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
it was just nice, you know. So we did, yeah, we enjoyed

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
it while we were there.

Andy & Chris:
think I had my most expensive coffee once on a lake,

Suzy Rowlands:
Ehh

Andy & Chris:
on a hotel on Lake Geneva. It was like 25 quid or something for

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
cappuccino and it was like,

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s

Andy & Chris:
my

Suzy Rowlands:
nuts.

Andy & Chris:
goodness,

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s and

Andy & Chris:
I only wanted one coffee, not

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
all

Suzy Rowlands:
can’t

Andy & Chris:
of them.

Suzy Rowlands:
go anywhere from Geneva apart from, say, Zurich or somewhere. Flying anywhere was a complete nightmare. You always have to go via somewhere.

Andy & Chris:
Mmm. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
You could fly back to the UK. That was when I developed my absolute hatred of EasyJet, because at that time, there weren’t nearly so many flights from

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
BA flights to Heathrow. So it was all, you know, EasyJet always did Geneva to Gatwick.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
But I can remember going to Sydney and leaving Geneva at about six o’clock on a Friday, then getting to Frankfurt at about 11, then getting on a plane at Frankfurt and waking up in Bangkok, no, not Thailand, Singapore, sometime on Saturday evening, I would

Andy & Chris:
Oh

Suzy Rowlands:
say,

Andy & Chris:
dearie mate.

Suzy Rowlands:
off the plane, walking around to try not to pass out from tiredness. back on the plane to Sydney and then arriving in Sydney on Sunday morning having lost two nights and a day. Oh it was

Andy & Chris:
Wow,

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah, it was no fun. It was no fun

Andy & Chris:
horrendous,

Suzy Rowlands:
at all.

Andy & Chris:
horrendous.

Suzy Rowlands:
Because there’s no,

Andy & Chris:
So.

Suzy Rowlands:
you know, there’s no, you can’t, you just can’t go anywhere. You can go to Zurich I suppose, that’s about it.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah. So we’re easing ourselves towards the BACD. We’re not

Suzy Rowlands:
We

Andy & Chris:
quite

Suzy Rowlands:
are.

Andy & Chris:
there yet. We’re not quite there

Suzy Rowlands:
Not quite.

Andy & Chris:
yet because between the French experience and you started with the BACD which is in 2005, you

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
then helped set up a wine importing company which is an interesting segue.

Suzy Rowlands:
So I came back, so we came back after 18 months, and I didn’t want to do anything that was massively taxing. I tend to gain, which is always a good way to find out what’s going on. And

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
then I was sent as a temp to work to see this. I was warned that, oh, he gets three PAs at a horrible rate. And I thought, hmm, let’s see about that. So he’s extraordinarily wealthy. And then she said, I’m sending you because you won’t take any. you know, shit from him. I said, I certainly won’t. And so, because I’d also, you know, I never had to worry about finding work. I knew I would be able to find work.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
It wasn’t, it wasn’t ever thinking, oh my gosh, I’m going to be on the breadline. I can’t pay my mortgage, blah, blah.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
So I went and it was in Covent Garden in Wellington Street, actually, just by where the Lion King is.

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And he was a very wealthy, I mean, billionaire wealthy Israeli businessman. And his brother had invented some sort of valve that is used in our open heart surgery. Don’t

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
ask me what it

Andy & Chris:
well.

Suzy Rowlands:
is, but it’s like a really, it’s like a life-saving thing

Andy & Chris:
Bye.

Suzy Rowlands:
that his brother had inherited. And the brother lived in Israel, but my boss lived in, well, he moved when I was there, St. James’s, you know, remember where WAC used to be at

Andy & Chris:
Mmm. Oh, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
the QE2 Center, and like further on, those lovely houses that are looking onto the park, well, that’s where he lived.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah. Wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
Gorgeous, I went there. times. But he was a very, he was a really, really nice man. And I think no one had ever sort of, I don’t know, people were just intimidated by him. I just thought

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
he was a nice, he was just nice. He was just very friendly.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
He was quite, he expected you to do a lot, but that was fine. And so what he wanted to do was set up a wine importing company. He poached all the best people, the buyers from M&S and Majestic and

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
all those wine warehouses, and then just set up this wine It was really, really good fun. And I learned so

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
much about wine when I was there. It was brilliant, especially white wine. And I can find my way around a wine list now. You know, it’s not that, you know what

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s like. You just buy stuff. You can never go wrong with a Chilean Merlot or an Argentinian Merlot. And you can, it was just fascinating. We had some really good wine tasting things. And then you’d go, there’s a big, there’s lots of things that. go on all over the country, but especially in London. And there used to be a wines of Chile, wines of Chile thing. And that was fascinating, because you’d go off to the ambassador would come round and he’d bring

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
all

Andy & Chris:
What

Suzy Rowlands:
the wines.

Andy & Chris:
I love about that story, Susie, is that guy came with quite bad press. Oh, don’t go. He’s always getting and then you

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
took

Suzy Rowlands:
and

Andy & Chris:
the

Suzy Rowlands:
he

Andy & Chris:
opportunity.

Suzy Rowlands:
was lovely! He

Andy & Chris:
And

Suzy Rowlands:
was really lovely!

Andy & Chris:
and that’s the thing. And so you had a you had a true firsthand opinion as opposed

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah. Yes,

Andy & Chris:
to

Suzy Rowlands:
he was really nice.

Andy & Chris:
listening to what other people said, because just because nobody else got on with him didn’t mean

Suzy Rowlands:
Exactly,

Andy & Chris:
he was a bad

Suzy Rowlands:
doesn’t

Andy & Chris:
person

Suzy Rowlands:
mean to say

Andy & Chris:
because you did.

Suzy Rowlands:
even

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
the benefit of the doubt. That’s what I

Andy & Chris:
I’ve

Suzy Rowlands:
say.

Andy & Chris:
always thought of you, Susie, as one of those people who never takes fools. You know, you’re like.

Suzy Rowlands:
No,

Andy & Chris:
Come

Suzy Rowlands:
no.

Andy & Chris:
on. But

Suzy Rowlands:
I think

Andy & Chris:
I think,

Suzy Rowlands:
he realised that, you know, I wasn’t

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
going to be putting up with any nonsense,

Andy & Chris:
you’ve always

Suzy Rowlands:
thank you.

Andy & Chris:
exuded

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh

Andy & Chris:
that to me, but it’s when I think of why we get on really, because it’s sort

Suzy Rowlands:
yes.

Andy & Chris:
of that just fun sort of respect thing, isn’t it, of the fact of actually, we’re gonna get a job done, but we’re also gonna have a bit of entertainment while we’re

Suzy Rowlands:
Absolutely.

Andy & Chris:
doing it.

Suzy Rowlands:
And he was, yeah, he was a good fellow. I worked quite hard, but it was, you know, that was what you did then. And it was great. It was a great office to work in because I could, you know, walk to work from Waterloo over the bridge. And it was, yeah, it was great fun in Covent Garden. So what more could you

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
want?

Andy & Chris:
lovely. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And he was very, yeah, he was very nice. He wasn’t, yeah, I was, you know, I was paid well. And then, and then BACD

Andy & Chris:
You got a nice wine

Suzy Rowlands:
happened.

Andy & Chris:
cellar. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Very nice wine

Andy & Chris:
Brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
cellar. Very nice wine cellar. Yes.

Andy & Chris:
I bet,

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
we

Andy & Chris:
bet.

Suzy Rowlands:
got given so much stuff. I’ll tell you this, because they would not just send one bottle. If you ask for something for a tasting, they send half a dozen bottles. So everything,

Andy & Chris:
Oh wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
literally, you’d be clanking home and then clanking home on the train. I’m sure regular commuters must think, my God, that woman, what is wrong with

Andy & Chris:
She’s

Suzy Rowlands:
her?

Andy & Chris:
an alcoholic.

Suzy Rowlands:
You know, she would have as much as you could possibly carry. and I’ll be phoning Reese and saying can you pick me up from the station again? Yes! Because I can’t drive you home! I just can’t! But yeah, it’s good.

Andy & Chris:
So then in February 2005 we sort of

Suzy Rowlands:
Mm.

Andy & Chris:
come full circle to where we started at the beginning which is you joined the BACD and

Suzy Rowlands:
Hmm.

Andy & Chris:
given that it had only just recently formed and as the British Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry that could

Suzy Rowlands:
British

Andy & Chris:
be,

Suzy Rowlands:
Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry, yeah.

Andy & Chris:
yeah so that was quite a new concept, cosmetic back in the early days when it

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
was created.

Suzy Rowlands:
I think it was.

Andy & Chris:
You know now… Cosmetics is a general term banded

Suzy Rowlands:
No,

Andy & Chris:
around

Suzy Rowlands:
no.

Andy & Chris:
dentistry quite commonly, but to think back in the early 2000s, it was quite a creative term. It was almost elite, wasn’t it? It was that sort of like, oh, that’s high end of… private dentistry and lots of poshness and ridiculously

Suzy Rowlands:
Mmm,

Andy & Chris:
expensive

Suzy Rowlands:
for sure.

Andy & Chris:
and all that sort of Yeah it was but then I yeah we were saying just before we started recording about the last congress in Newport last year yet how many young dentists now are involved so whilst yes it’s cosmetic and it inspires and inspires people to get better and on the academy side I think was it was it Frank Spear you had as your speaker last

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
year you know you’re

Suzy Rowlands:
Hmm.

Andy & Chris:
Is it the magic ingredients that you’ve experienced and put together that have made it the community it is? Because you’ve been there pretty much since the beginning. How

Suzy Rowlands:
No.

Andy & Chris:
have you built it in the way that it’s come along?

Suzy Rowlands:
I think the key word there is it’s a community. I mean, you know what it’s like. We know pretty

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
much all of them. Having, I’m the one constant because people come and go.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And whilst people are on the board for a while and when we first started, we discuss in the board then that it was important to have continuity. We couldn’t, because what happens now is you’re president for one year. Because it is a big commitment, you know, you’re on the board.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah

Suzy Rowlands:
and then your, you know, your vice president, your president-elect, your president, your immediate past president. So that’s like five or six years, which is

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
a long time. And you have to think about the commitment before you decide you want to do this and think long and hard. So you’re not paid for it. And whilst you, you know, whilst you can say, I am the president of the BACD, you can’t use it to sort of, you know, make money off or you can’t. We have extraordinarily strict rules. about

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
we always have had, you know, you can’t use it for personal gain.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And we felt it was important to have the same leadership in place for about, I think Chris was president for four years, possibly even five. And but it was that it built up from a family and even now, 20 years later, I mean, I am seeing some people who obviously have retired, who were older dentists when we started, but I’m still

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
seeing people who have been members for a really, really long time. And they’re always committed.

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And every year, so my key thing, when I’ve put the conference up for booking and it’s sort of beginning of when it went up for booking, it’s always up in time for the dentistry show because we can then advertise it.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And there’s two members who’ve been coming for years and I live in fear. They will have to retire at some point. They must be my age. There’s Jai Shah and Hanif Moti. I know all is well with the world. I’m just, as soon as they’ve booked, I put something in my board WhatsApp group and I said, it’s the boys have booked, everything’s okay this year. If it was just those, would you be happy?

Andy & Chris:
They’re your non-financial indicator.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, I’d be happy.

Andy & Chris:
It’s like

Suzy Rowlands:
And…

Andy & Chris:
the litmus strip going into the conga. Oh, yes, we’re okay. We’re

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh

Andy & Chris:
okay. We’re sorted, yeah. Brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah, we’re there, we’re there. And it has changed for sure, gone are the days where you have big, we used to get 500 easily, four or 500 at a conference, and you

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
don’t anymore because you just don’t, we’re not that big an organisation. Yes, the ADI do, but there’s lots more of them than there are of us. But we’ve maintained a fairly steady membership. Attendance has gone down, I would say, but I don’t think that’s a reflection on us. I think it’s just a reflection on dentistry in general and conferences

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
in general. And we always get quality rather than quantity, because you know, as exhibitors, that

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
we tend to get the practice owners and we get, you know, we don’t have, we have the spenders who come to our conference.

Andy & Chris:
Mm. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And we have, and you also have people who really do want to expand their knowledge. And it’s interesting when I put the event up for booking, or we had pre-booking in November. So we hadn’t finalized day one with the hands-on sessions.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
We’ve got eight this year, again, one of them is the young dentist stream. We had a vague idea of who was coming, but we just hadn’t finalized it for all sorts of reasons.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And we put it up for booking, and I think we got 65 people just booked, bang, without knowing, and all of them booked for all three days. They had no idea who was coming on the Thursday and they weren’t particularly bothered. They just booked.

Andy & Chris:
But that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
Because they’d always come. Hmm.

Andy & Chris:
past reputation, isn’t it? People

Suzy Rowlands:
Exactly

Andy & Chris:
know

Suzy Rowlands:
that.

Andy & Chris:
that in previous years it’s been good. So whilst we don’t know the names, you’re not going to be putting up people who aren’t going to be world-class.

Suzy Rowlands:
No, and we’ve got, yes, again, we’ve got, you know, we’ve got good speakers coming. But it’s interesting when you look at hands-on sessions, what you think will sell out straight away doesn’t always, but

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
ones that you think, I don’t know, always just go quickly. It’s very

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
interesting.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
You can never,

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
ever predict it though. It’s impossible to predict,

Andy & Chris:
It’s

Suzy Rowlands:
absolutely

Andy & Chris:
you think

Suzy Rowlands:
impossible.

Andy & Chris:
you know, don’t you? We find it sometimes we practice out, don’t you know? We look at the stuff the guys are put into the market and you think, oh yeah, that’ll fly. That’ll fly, oh no, it hasn’t

Suzy Rowlands:
No.

Andy & Chris:
flown at all. And then there’ll be another one where you think. I think that’s going to be a bit tricky. Oh, hello. We’ve got three offers on it and it’s in the

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah?

Andy & Chris:
middle of Shropshire or something,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah!

Andy & Chris:
but who knew that Shropshire

Suzy Rowlands:
Who

Andy & Chris:
would become

Suzy Rowlands:
knew?

Andy & Chris:
a hotbed

Suzy Rowlands:
Who knew?

Andy & Chris:
of dental activity? It’s amazing. But I think it keeps us on our toes. I think that’s a great thing. But also I think you, going back to that community thing, I think the events you put on as well, outside of Congress, you know, the way that

Suzy Rowlands:
Hmm.

Andy & Chris:
you engage people and the way you promote yourself as well, because it’s a fine balance because it… could look and feel a bit elitist, but it’s

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
not.

Suzy Rowlands:
we are as you know, we’re absolutely not but you’re absolutely right. Yeah people do think oh, it’s all cosmetic dentistry it’s all private it’s blah and Cosmetic dentistry is elective. Nobody’s forcing you to have it

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
and yet still people are You know going to have whatever they’re having done, you know, there was this

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
after lockdown There was the Zumba, you know people seeing themselves on the screen and getting yikes

Andy & Chris:
Yeah. Give me that Botox.

Suzy Rowlands:
whitened

Andy & Chris:
But

Suzy Rowlands:
and everything

Andy & Chris:
I also

Suzy Rowlands:
else.

Andy & Chris:
love the way that kind of the cosmetic, strotoesthetic element carries through to where you host your events as well. I didn’t come to Edinburgh, but I saw the footage of the Edinburgh venue. I mean, what a

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh,

Andy & Chris:
spectacular

Suzy Rowlands:
the Garland dinner. Ha ha ha!

Andy & Chris:
venue. It was an incredible venue. And I know that I think you’re

Suzy Rowlands:
It

Andy & Chris:
in

Suzy Rowlands:
was,

Andy & Chris:
London this year,

Suzy Rowlands:
it was,

Andy & Chris:
aren’t you? So

Suzy Rowlands:
it

Andy & Chris:
you

Suzy Rowlands:
was,

Andy & Chris:
always.

Suzy Rowlands:
it was masterful in Edinburgh because it was the first one after lockdown and everyone

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
loves Edinburgh. Quite frankly, I’d have all my conferences there because

Andy & Chris:
Hahaha

Suzy Rowlands:
the conference industry is so easy, they’re so easy to deal with.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s not perfect, but nowhere’s perfect. However, yeah, the National Museum of Scotland was just an inspired choice because quite frankly, there’s not, there are a lot of places to go and also… That was the one that very nearly finished me off because normally we would get around about I don’t know 150, 160 at the gala dinner. This gala dinner just started going utterly bonkers. Coupled with the fact that having introduced the ability to book more than one ticket at a time, so say you booked and you wanted to bring, you can book as many as you want and you thought right, you know what, I know I’m going to book 10 myself plus nine others. But the total wasn’t, so I downloaded this and it was like 70 or so. And I thought that’s not anywhere near enough because I’d seen all the, you know, I have the bookings

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
and I added them all up. Oh, no. Where are they going to go? What am I going to do with them all? Because it was, you know, it was like about 250. What’s

Andy & Chris:
Oh, I guess they’re

Suzy Rowlands:
anyway, after

Andy & Chris:
multiple

Suzy Rowlands:
a slight

Andy & Chris:
tickets.

Suzy Rowlands:
panic attack, I realised that in fact, you could see 900 in there, so we would have been fine. But thank goodness we were. And then. we suddenly went and everybody who went to that is going to come again and everyone

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
who didn’t go to that is definitely going to come again because we had 320 at that which was

Andy & Chris:
Well.

Suzy Rowlands:
unheard of you know but it’s not like there isn’t anywhere else to go in edinburgh on a friday night there isn’t um although there was some very weird covid rules still in place that

Andy & Chris:
Yes.

Suzy Rowlands:
nicola tried to push through about you couldn’t have at midnight, or like one minute past midnight, you had to either stop music or stop dancing or stop drinking. You could only have two out of three. So I

Andy & Chris:
What?

Suzy Rowlands:
thought, I know, I know, it’s just this random thing. So she’d introduced this rule, which she’d been trying to push through for months and months and months, but everyone had resisted it. So in the end, we just took the music down to like lounge music.

Andy & Chris:
I say so

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
is

Suzy Rowlands:
the music

Andy & Chris:
it is

Suzy Rowlands:
was

Andy & Chris:
it

Suzy Rowlands:
so amazing.

Andy & Chris:
is it is a logic is it is a logic look that COVID knew if you were drinking and listening to music,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
it

Suzy Rowlands:
yes,

Andy & Chris:
would keep you safe. If you’re drinking, listening to music and started dancing, come

Suzy Rowlands:
that’s

Andy & Chris:
for you.

Suzy Rowlands:
it.

Andy & Chris:
Because you’re breathing out

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
more.

Suzy Rowlands:
and also you were fine until midnight. And then after that, it all

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
went pear-shaped. And apparently, they were telling us that in nightclubs, in nightclubs, they were pushing a sofa out into the middle of the floor. I says, no, it’s a lounge area. It’s a dance floor. What? No, nobody’s dancing. It’s a lounge area. But it was as if it

Andy & Chris:
People

Suzy Rowlands:
was a third.

Andy & Chris:
got very creative, didn’t they?

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, very creative. So then last year we realised that, you know, we would have to up our game. So last year we got a company in to do it called Eventologist. So we had this theme and yeah, it went really well. So this year, you just wait until you see it this year.

Andy & Chris:
I’m sure most of the planning is already done.

Suzy Rowlands:
It is, yes, most of the planning is already done. We’re just deciding on some features, should we say? Some features.

Andy & Chris:
Features.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
And in a weird way, I think you might perhaps have benefited because Edinburgh is a spectacular location. That was your

Suzy Rowlands:
Exactly.

Andy & Chris:
first one post COVID.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
Then you had Newport with the red dragon.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
So it might actually start to get the core but we’ll

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
be slightly bigger moving

Suzy Rowlands:
yes,

Andy & Chris:
forward

Suzy Rowlands:
for

Andy & Chris:
now.

Suzy Rowlands:
sure. Absolutely. And you get an awful lot of people going to the dinner who don’t necessarily go to the actual conference, because

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
people tell their friends about it. And quite frankly, I don’t mind who go, you know, you’re buying

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
a ticket, you can’t restrict people. Why would you do that?

Andy & Chris:
Especially in London as well because it’s instantly

Suzy Rowlands:
I know.

Andy & Chris:
or infinitely

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
more accessible, isn’t it?

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s, it is more accessible. So, but I’m going to have to come up with something super spectacular for next year, because it’s the 20th anniversary and there’s not, you know, there’s not that many. There are places, but I don’t want people, I don’t want to have to, you know, bus people across town or something like that.

Andy & Chris:
No.

Suzy Rowlands:
Because

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
a Friday night in London is pretty awful anyway, isn’t it? So,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah.

Andy & Chris:
do you enjoy do you enjoy the challenge of every year? Needing to find

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh yes,

Andy & Chris:
something different

Suzy Rowlands:
for sure.

Andy & Chris:
or more creative or bigger or better or whatever and

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh

Andy & Chris:
pushing

Suzy Rowlands:
yes,

Andy & Chris:
it on

Suzy Rowlands:
absolutely.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah

Suzy Rowlands:
The bigger the better if you ask me. And it’s trying to think of, it’s trying, the only, let’s say, I’m used to working, when I came from the FDI, I was used to working a very long way in advance, like five or six years in advance. And I’ve had to, that’s the only thing that there isn’t that, there is a sense of urgency, but there isn’t that huge sense of urgency. And whilst we

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
don’t have to work five years in advance here, we still have to, you know, we’re booked. to 27. So 25

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
will probably be Manchester, which I’m

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
quite happy about. 26 will be back in London and 27

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
will be Edinburgh because we’re already committed.

Andy & Chris:
Well.

Suzy Rowlands:
But at some

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
point I have to retire because I am quite old now.

Andy & Chris:
Will

Suzy Rowlands:
But

Andy & Chris:
they

Suzy Rowlands:
every

Andy & Chris:
let you

Suzy Rowlands:
time

Andy & Chris:
know?

Suzy Rowlands:
I

Andy & Chris:
But

Suzy Rowlands:
mention

Andy & Chris:
you but you

Suzy Rowlands:
it, people will put their fingers in their ears and go, la, la. Well, I won’t stand there, but can you, oh, Suze, if I stand for president, will you stay on? And I’m just like, I’ll be 100. I’ll be 100.

Andy & Chris:
But you’ll still be enjoying it, that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
I’m sorry.

Andy & Chris:
the thing, knowing you. And the thing is, it’s not that you just do this for the BACD, you

Suzy Rowlands:
No!

Andy & Chris:
also offer executive admin to the BAPD, which is a fairly new organisation that kind

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
of came about at Covid, particularly focused on private dentistry and also

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
the BADD. And

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
I think one of the things that strikes me about dentistry is it’s a very collaborative profession.

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, it

Andy & Chris:
You’re

Suzy Rowlands:
is.

Andy & Chris:
a shining example of the fact that you can step across different organizations and work with different groups and people aren’t operating in silos. And I think for you as an individual, it gives you a great sense and temperature of how the profession is and how would you kind of characterize

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, I completely

Andy & Chris:
the profession at the moment?

Suzy Rowlands:
agree with you. I completely agree with you. The BADT, they are all delightful. It’s got a good membership

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
and they’re all absolutely lovely. All of them, they’re great. A lot of them were treated appallingly during lockdown,

Andy & Chris:
Hmm

Suzy Rowlands:
particularly in NHS practices. We had anguished emails and phone calls from members who were not being paid. So… or the practices were getting their money, you know,

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
which they’re supposed to pass on to their staff, but in fact they weren’t, they were holding onto

Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
it. People were saying, you know, I have to pay my mortgage, I’ve got to feed my children.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
So in the end, the GDC did set up the helpline to sort them out. And they had their conference last Saturday, which not Saturday, just Saturday before that.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And in London, it was the 60th anniversary of them sort of being recognized. And it was brilliant. It wasn’t a huge meeting. It was just a one day meeting, but everybody who was there loved it. And it’s interesting

Andy & Chris:
Lovely.

Suzy Rowlands:
what you say about people can be apathetic about coming to meetings. And I think they have, sometimes they’ve forgotten how much better it is to come to a meeting in person and to network. And

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
whilst it is about the learning, it is also about meeting your peers and meeting other therapists. there was a dinner in the evening and there were a couple of girls on my table who said they hadn’t been to anything before, they were quite young, and they

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
said it was absolutely brilliant and it would encourage them now to go to more in-person events

Andy & Chris:
Hmm,

Suzy Rowlands:
to learn

Andy & Chris:
but

Suzy Rowlands:
because

Andy & Chris:
that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
they said you can’t

Andy & Chris:
lovely builds

Suzy Rowlands:
always

Andy & Chris:
that community

Suzy Rowlands:
rely

Andy & Chris:
back to that word community,

Suzy Rowlands:
on

Andy & Chris:
aren’t

Suzy Rowlands:
distance

Andy & Chris:
you?

Suzy Rowlands:
learning, can you?

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, no,

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s not

Andy & Chris:
no

Suzy Rowlands:
the same, is it?

Andy & Chris:
And I think that’s why fundamentally I’m not a massive fan of working from home. I think working from home works up to a certain point, but

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh

Andy & Chris:
I think

Suzy Rowlands:
yes.

Andy & Chris:
that sense of community, working with other people, you know,

Suzy Rowlands:
Mm.

Andy & Chris:
just building bonds and relationships, it’s not as easy and we are social creatures. So it’s lovely to hear they came to the event and enjoyed it. It’s conversations

Suzy Rowlands:
they did,

Andy & Chris:
in

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
coffee

Suzy Rowlands:
loved it.

Andy & Chris:
time, isn’t it? That’s what the brilliant

Suzy Rowlands:
And the

Andy & Chris:
bit

Suzy Rowlands:
BAPD,

Andy & Chris:
about all that is.

Suzy Rowlands:
whilst they’re not going to have sort of a conference because it’s not that sort of organisation,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
I picked up so much I didn’t know because really, you know, with the BACD, it’s, the huge, vast majority are private dentists, they just are,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
but the BAPD is a much bigger mix and most of the people who set it up are former. or current BACD members and some past

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
presidents. So I knew most of them, but they’re a delightful bunch and I’ve met some really, really nice people through them. And they’re doing quite well. They’ve done the theaters at

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
the show,

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
at the dentistry show.

Andy & Chris:
But what’s interesting about that as well is that from the name, you assume,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
all they’re interested in is private dentistry to exclusion of everything else. I saw you at the show, I was talking to Bertie and Simon,

Suzy Rowlands:
Mmm.

Andy & Chris:
and they’re like, no, we need to also understand NHS dentistry

Suzy Rowlands:
Definitely.

Andy & Chris:
because the reality is very few practices are purely one or the other. They’re still a huge cohort

Suzy Rowlands:
Ehh

Andy & Chris:
that deliver mixed dentistry and they’ve got a really… sensible attitude to dentistry and go back to that thing about it being collaborative. They’re not just pigeonholed themselves. It’s a smart move. Inclusive, not exclusive. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
That’s exactly it. And as you say, there’s a lot of practices who either were nudged by COVID or were thinking about it before then going from NHS to private. And they haven’t the faintest idea what to do. Just, they have no idea.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
They have absolutely no idea. And so there’s a lot of, you know, they’re constantly doing webinars and stuff like that.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And we’ve just updated the website. And then I’ve said to them, I think it will be a good idea to have something. and I’m mooting the idea of having it in October, but we’ll see, is just to have a little get together, just even if it’s just for the board and all the committees and anyone

Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
else who wants to come, just to have a bit of CPD and then

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
do something else. Because again, it’s that meeting your peers in person. And it

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
doesn’t

Andy & Chris:
it

Suzy Rowlands:
have

Andy & Chris:
is.

Suzy Rowlands:
to be something super formal. I don’t think that

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
necessarily always works, does it? Not anymore, it doesn’t,

Andy & Chris:
No,

Suzy Rowlands:
it just doesn’t.

Andy & Chris:
no,

Suzy Rowlands:
I think those days

Andy & Chris:
no.

Suzy Rowlands:
are gone now, aren’t they?

Andy & Chris:
I think any event you go to the most interesting conversations are with a glass of wine in the evening. Yeah, with a coffee, with a chat. Yeah, that’s where the kind of the really good stuff comes from.

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, absolutely.

Andy & Chris:
What it…

Suzy Rowlands:
And it’s we we’re doing. So we did the Porsche day, which

Andy & Chris:
Yes.

Suzy Rowlands:
on the came and filmed, which we

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
were away, but it looked really amazing. We were in

Andy & Chris:
Yes. He

Suzy Rowlands:
Croatia.

Andy & Chris:
said it was a great day. Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
But we’ve got the we’ve got the summer social coming up this year, which is at a brewery. So it’s the Windsor and Eaton Brewery. You’re welcome to come. It’s the Windsor

Andy & Chris:
Sounds

Suzy Rowlands:
and Eaton

Andy & Chris:
like fun.

Suzy Rowlands:
Brewery, which is owned by Millie Morrison, who’s on one of our committees,

Andy & Chris:
Oh yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
two of our committees.

Andy & Chris:
Yep.

Suzy Rowlands:
Her father owns it. So when I, so

Andy & Chris:
That’s

Suzy Rowlands:
we were

Andy & Chris:
convenient!

Suzy Rowlands:
talking about the finer details in January at the Board and Committee Day and I, I was, I had what my husband refers to as the 100 year old cough which everybody seemed to have, you know, I’ve been coughing since sometime in mid

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
December. Well, still wasn’t, I still haven’t had Covid, it wasn’t that. However, I just, I wasn’t feeling brilliant. So we went to the sort of social bit we’d done afterwards and then I got back to the hotel room and I phoned Reece and I said, oh, we’re doing this. social event in August, so block the dates because we’ll come down for it in Windsor. And I said, it’s Millie Morris, I said, you know Millie, Millie Morrison, who’s lovely. I said, you know, her father owns the brewery and we’re doing this, this and this. And he said to me, is she married? I said, no, darling, but you are. So,

Andy & Chris:
Hahahaha!

Suzy Rowlands:
yes. So, so Reece said, you must, must make it really, really good because otherwise everyone’s going to do the you can’t organise a

Andy & Chris:
Hahaha!

Suzy Rowlands:
So it’s going to run from four o’clock in the afternoon. And then there’ll be some education. There’ll be an hour of education.

Andy & Chris:
Every

Suzy Rowlands:
And then there’s

Andy & Chris:
some education.

Suzy Rowlands:
food, barbecue, all sorts of lovely barbecue food. And

Andy & Chris:
Oh, it sounds wonderful.

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah, it’s going to be brilliant. And there’s going to be some BACD beer as well. It’s going to be really

Andy & Chris:
Oh brilliant.

Suzy Rowlands:
cool. So it’s going to be very good. Yes, we had quite a lot of

Andy & Chris:
Susie,

Suzy Rowlands:
people.

Andy & Chris:
as somebody who’s so incredibly well placed in the profession, what are your predictions for the future dentistry? Where

Suzy Rowlands:
What are my

Andy & Chris:
do

Suzy Rowlands:
predictions

Andy & Chris:
you see

Suzy Rowlands:
for the

Andy & Chris:
it

Suzy Rowlands:
future

Andy & Chris:
heading?

Suzy Rowlands:
of dentistry? Oh, don’t let me say. Well, the GDC needs to sort itself out. It is just

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
shocking. I mean, I don’t even know where to start with them. Could they be more unhelpful? No, I don’t think they could, could they?

Andy & Chris:
No.

Suzy Rowlands:
They just couldn’t. It’s every single time they come out, and there’s a lot of this in my BAPD WhatsApp group, as soon as

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
some idiotic announcement comes up, but you couldn’t make some of it up. You just couldn’t. Do they really

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
hate dentists that much? They appear to, don’t they?

Andy & Chris:
I don’t know the GDC. I mean

Suzy Rowlands:
They

Andy & Chris:
we

Suzy Rowlands:
do.

Andy & Chris:
had that Jim. Well, that was that article I think we were talking to some about it, you know when they did that full-page advert about do you want to sue your dentist? Effectively

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
what it was saying. It’s like

Suzy Rowlands:
yeah,

Andy & Chris:
who

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s

Andy & Chris:
does

Suzy Rowlands:
great.

Andy & Chris:
that?

Suzy Rowlands:
No, no, go ahead. Don’t worry about the dentists. That’s absolutely fine. Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, smartass,

Suzy Rowlands:
they’re absolutely

Andy & Chris:
smartass.

Suzy Rowlands:
fine. And I think, yeah, NHS dentistry is in a shocking state. However,

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
people have to take more responsibility for their own dental health. I had a lovely dentist as a child. He was a really nice man and I never used to mind going. And I carried on coming back home to the dentist until I was in my early 30s. mostly because my

Andy & Chris:
Wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
mother would pay. And mostly because I didn’t. So I’ve got a crown on my front central. When I was about, ooh, I must have been at primary school, so I was about, I don’t know. My tooth wouldn’t grow down. It kind of got halfway and it stuck. So I went to the dentist and he gave me this revolting injection and it came down, you know, almost straight away. And then, I was, roller skate, I can still remember this, it was a very long time ago, it was like 50 or more than 50 years ago. And I was roller skating across the playground at the primary school and we were little children and we were on a big row, you know, holding hands, all of us were going, I was somewhere in the middle. And there was a drain. Yeah, so I went flying over it and flew face forward and chipped my tooth. And yeah, there was a lot of blood everywhere and it chipped it. But my mother was… furious because it had only just gone down. So he was furious. So off I trotted to go and see the dentist, who was right opposite my school, my ended up at the school I ended up at Shrewsbury High School. So off I trotted, he just put composite on it and then it stayed there till I was 18. And then I had a crown and it was fine. And then my crown stayed on until I was in my early thirties. And then I went to a local dentist because I knew I would have to, you know, come up and down.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
all the time to

Andy & Chris:
pay

Suzy Rowlands:
have it,

Andy & Chris:
for it.

Suzy Rowlands:
have to pay for it and have it done. Yes, so, yes, exactly. And my mother would have paid for it, but never

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
mind. And I was, yeah, they, yeah, they, it was sorted out and that was that. And then after that, when I, so the reason I, part of the reason I was involved with, the main reason I was involved with the BAC was because of Chris Orr. So he was my dentist. So I met him

Andy & Chris:
Ah,

Suzy Rowlands:
in Hong

Andy & Chris:
okay.

Suzy Rowlands:
Kong in 1995. He was on a committee and he was still a student because he’s 10 years younger than I am. So he was still a student and we met and he became my dentist. I was very lucky that he turned into Dr.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Rall, the best dentist. So he then graduated and he was working in Soho. So he was working just around the corner from me

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
for Oasis. So he was, yeah, he’s not even five minutes walk from my office. And then that was then. I was quite lucky, you know, he could have been a terrible dentist and I would have still been stuck with him, you know. So he said, Oh, you know, do you want to be my patient? I said, yes. And he’s very good. So that’s partly how, you know, I knew him because he

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
sat on some of my student committees at the FDI and when

Andy & Chris:
Mm-hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
we kept in touch and then he turned into, you know,

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
best dentist

Andy & Chris:
but

Suzy Rowlands:
ever.

Andy & Chris:
I think you’re right about that taking responsibility for your dental

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
health. I think there’s a lot of people out there, as in the population, who could easily transition themselves over into the private dentistry world,

Suzy Rowlands:
Of course

Andy & Chris:
but

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
for

Suzy Rowlands:
could.

Andy & Chris:
whatever reason don’t, which would then free up huge capacity

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah. Of course

Andy & Chris:
for

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
the

Suzy Rowlands:
would,

Andy & Chris:
people

Suzy Rowlands:
of course

Andy & Chris:
that do

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
need

Suzy Rowlands:
would.

Andy & Chris:
it. Because I think we’d all love to still see an NHS component. of dentistry.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, of course

Andy & Chris:
It would

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
be

Suzy Rowlands:
would!

Andy & Chris:
a real shame

Suzy Rowlands:
You can’t

Andy & Chris:
if it

Suzy Rowlands:
not! You

Andy & Chris:
wasn’t

Suzy Rowlands:
can’t

Andy & Chris:
available

Suzy Rowlands:
not!

Andy & Chris:
but it needs to work. At the moment it’s not working.

Suzy Rowlands:
And people who, you know, you see this a lot with the therapists who say that they seem to think that we can perform miracles. But if you haven’t been to your dentist, I mean, I always came back to go to the dentist. You know, I always saw the hygienist every six months and the dentist for a checkup once a year. Partly because, and it’s not like, I mean, in my childhood, it was drill and fill because they were paid

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
per

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
filling, weren’t they? Probably the same as you.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And Chris has replaced all my fillings with white composite. But… He said, you know, these have lasted, don’t knock them out because these fittings have lasted

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
for 30 or 40 years

Andy & Chris:
it’s right.

Suzy Rowlands:
and they’re

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
perfectly okay. He said, they’re not going to fail anytime soon. So,

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
you know, don’t knock it. And yes, not everyone can afford to pay for cosmetic dentistry. However, I’ll never forget, this is a few years ago, listening to a radio program, we were in the car going somewhere or other and we had the radio on because there were traffic queues up ahead and then they were interviewing some chap. and the radio interview was, he was moaning about, oh I can’t go to the dentist and I’ve got toothache and blah and oh it’s going to cost this much and it wasn’t very much. So the interviewer said, can I ask you, could you mind if I just ask you, have you been on holiday this year? He said, oh yes, we’ve been away twice and we’re going to a villa in the blah rest of this year. And he said, any other car? He said, oh yes, my wife and I both just had new cars. And yet he wouldn’t spend 200

Andy & Chris:
Mmm,

Suzy Rowlands:
quid

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
on going to

Andy & Chris:
on

Suzy Rowlands:
the

Andy & Chris:
his

Suzy Rowlands:
dentist.

Andy & Chris:
teeth.

Suzy Rowlands:
And the interviewer said, well, I’m not quite sure what to say to you, but clearly you don’t, I think he was expecting an easy ride. And they had people

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
phoning in saying, what an idiot.

Andy & Chris:
Mmm, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Nobody like wants to have to pay, but sometimes just suck it up. And you get one set of teeth. Why do people not realize this? One set

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
of teeth,

Andy & Chris:
yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
one set

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
of teeth. You’re not going to get any others.

Andy & Chris:
I always remember there was a dentist, some professor, and he said, if people really understood that if you had to replace each tooth, and he said, you know, let’s just say 2,000 pounds an implant, he said, 64,000 pounds. He said, I bet you someone with a 64,000 pound car would service it, wash it, make sure it was looked after.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yep,

Andy & Chris:
He

Suzy Rowlands:
they

Andy & Chris:
said,

Suzy Rowlands:
would.

Andy & Chris:
and somehow

Suzy Rowlands:
And yes…

Andy & Chris:
we need to turn what we give them with. into people seeing not just the health benefit,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
but almost the financial benefit of looking after them. It’s

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s

Andy & Chris:
nuts,

Suzy Rowlands:
because

Andy & Chris:
isn’t it?

Suzy Rowlands:
if you don’t, yeah, it’s the thing that, prevention is better than cure.

Andy & Chris:
Yes.

Suzy Rowlands:
I clean my teeth twice a day, I floss. I do all the things

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
you’re supposed to do. And I always have done, it’s just purely coincidental that I’ve ended up where I’ve ended up because I’ve always been

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
good about going to the dentist. I had a nice dentist as a child. He was a lovely, lovely man. He had to retire early, he had some heart condition. So he was probably only in his 50s when he retired.

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
And then he was replaced by another absolutely delightful dentist who lived just down the road from my mother. And it wasn’t until I had to get this sorted out that

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
I stopped going there and they were just lovely. They

Andy & Chris:
It’s almost a GD’s

Suzy Rowlands:
were really nice.

Andy & Chris:
Going back to GDC thing. They probably should be doing an advert campaign that says you service your car once a year Why not service your mouth in that sort of thing

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
of

Suzy Rowlands:
but

Andy & Chris:
bringing

Suzy Rowlands:
it is.

Andy & Chris:
to people?

Suzy Rowlands:
It is. You only have to get in. I don’t go more than once a year. I went, I don’t, I don’t need to. And if I had a problem,

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
of course, I mean, I go to see James Russell now, who luckily for all of us has moved back to Shropshire. He moved back before we did, because otherwise I think I’d probably go back down to see Chris. But I do see James, so we’re lucky that we’ve got someone, you know, who is as good here. And I

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
try and send all my friends to him. But I do. I mean, I go regularly, because why wouldn’t you?

Andy & Chris:
Yes, it’s madness.

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s just,

Andy & Chris:
Absolutely

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s

Andy & Chris:
madness.

Suzy Rowlands:
I can’t understand the rationale between, you know, long before I ever came any near any

Andy & Chris:
Mm.

Suzy Rowlands:
jobs that involved dentistry, I always went to the dentist. It’s like, I don’t know if you had, if you, I don’t know if something fell off or started bleeding, you’d go to the doctor, wouldn’t you? Or perhaps

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, that’s

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
right.

Suzy Rowlands:
wouldn’t,

Andy & Chris:
You can

Suzy Rowlands:
I don’t

Andy & Chris:
just

Suzy Rowlands:
know.

Andy & Chris:
leave it. You’d hope so. You’d hope so. You’d hope so. Suzie, we always wrap up in the same way.

Suzy Rowlands:
Okay.

Andy & Chris:
We always ask our guests the same two questions. So

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
the first question we have for you is if you could be the fly on a wall with somebody in a certain situation, when would that be and who would be there?

Suzy Rowlands:
Right, I would like to, I’m obsessed by polar exploration. Not doing it,

Andy & Chris:
Okay

Suzy Rowlands:
obviously. It’s cold, it’s dangerous. No one

Andy & Chris:
Oh

Suzy Rowlands:
wants

Andy & Chris:
well.

Suzy Rowlands:
to do any of that. Thank you very much. Frostbite. No, just no. But I would love to know, I would love to be in the hut with Captain Scott at the beginning of the expedition, obviously not when everything went pear shaped, but just

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
to see how they were laying everything out and how they were deciding who was going to which bits and how they had their maps drawn out and how

Andy & Chris:
My

Suzy Rowlands:
long they thought it would all take. I’d love to have known how that all happened.

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
Then it did go a bit wrong, didn’t it? So, but that

Andy & Chris:
It did.

Suzy Rowlands:
wasn’t really their fault, was it? They were stimmied by the bad weather, and that was that.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, which is it’s an interesting thing you’d like to know given somebody who has to plan such

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
huge

Suzy Rowlands:
it’s there you go,

Andy & Chris:
events

Suzy Rowlands:
I see. It’s

Andy & Chris:
with

Suzy Rowlands:
the planning.

Andy & Chris:
so many components

Suzy Rowlands:
The planning.

Andy & Chris:
Isn’t it? You know

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
to get to that ultimate planning experience would be quite interesting Is that Captain Oates was he on the Scot?

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, that was Captain Oates. And it was so cold, I mean I’ve read lots of books about it, but it was so cold that people’s teeth shattered. That’s how cold it was.

Andy & Chris:
Wow.

Suzy Rowlands:
I mean that’s cold, isn’t it?

Andy & Chris:
My

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
goodness. Bloody hell,

Suzy Rowlands:
Teeth

Andy & Chris:
that is

Suzy Rowlands:
shattered.

Andy & Chris:
cool.

Suzy Rowlands:
The teeth-shattering man actually came back. There’s quite a few of them came back. Captain Oates obviously didn’t and Captain Scott, but quite a few of them came back and Mr.

Andy & Chris:
Hmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
Shattered Teeth Man came back, yeah.

Andy & Chris:
Dear

Suzy Rowlands:
You

Andy & Chris:
me,

Suzy Rowlands:
can’t

Andy & Chris:
that

Suzy Rowlands:
imagine

Andy & Chris:
is cold.

Suzy Rowlands:
being somewhere where it is cold enough to shatter your teeth, can

Andy & Chris:
No,

Suzy Rowlands:
you?

Andy & Chris:
you can’t, can you? You just can’t.

Suzy Rowlands:
It’s impossible to comprehend.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
And no amount of, even if you were there nowadays, no amount of proper clothing and everything is going to stop that much cold. Is it? No.

Andy & Chris:
No, no, no. And lastly, Sue, if you were

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
given the opportunity to meet somebody, who would you like to sit down with one of your lovely glasses of white wine with for an hour?

Suzy Rowlands:
Keith Richards, cast to be, he’s my absolute hero. I mean, look at him,

Andy & Chris:
Oh,

Suzy Rowlands:
look at him. I love him, I adore

Andy & Chris:
well, Roni

Suzy Rowlands:
him.

Andy & Chris:
Stone’s Keith Richards.

Suzy Rowlands:
He can do no wrong as far as I’m concerned. No, he’s the perfect

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
man, he’s still

Andy & Chris:
think he’s

Suzy Rowlands:
alive.

Andy & Chris:
done a lot of wrong, to be honest, Susan.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes, he has, but look, he’s very well preserved. He’s done all that stuff he shouldn’t have done and he’s still with us, isn’t he? He’s still touring, he’s still with us.

Andy & Chris:
I think very well preserved is a good phrase for him.

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah, you see, it’s very well preserved.

Andy & Chris:
Pickled.

Suzy Rowlands:
He is, he’s marvelous. He may be

Andy & Chris:
Pickled

Suzy Rowlands:
pickled.

Andy & Chris:
from the inside out. He’s lived a life. I bet he’s got some stories.

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, can you imagine?

Andy & Chris:
He probably can’t remember

Suzy Rowlands:
Can you imagine? Just don’t.

Andy & Chris:
them

Suzy Rowlands:
I

Andy & Chris:
though.

Suzy Rowlands:
think

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
he’d be up

Andy & Chris:
I

Suzy Rowlands:
for a drink, don’t you?

Andy & Chris:
think to have Jack Sparrow from Pirates of the Caribbean based on you as a real life character, you know you’ve done

Suzy Rowlands:
I know.

Andy & Chris:
something right. That’s very

Suzy Rowlands:
That’d

Andy & Chris:
true.

Suzy Rowlands:
be

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
marvellous.

Andy & Chris:
no, they are. They are amazing and they’re still performing and touring the Rolling Stones

Suzy Rowlands:
They

Andy & Chris:
aren’t

Suzy Rowlands:
are

Andy & Chris:
they? It’s

Suzy Rowlands:
still

Andy & Chris:
remarkable.

Suzy Rowlands:
performing and touring. Yes, we haven’t seen them for a while. We have seen them a few times, but not recently. Because it’s just, it’s

Andy & Chris:
Nah.

Suzy Rowlands:
super expensive for a start, isn’t it?

Andy & Chris:
Yes, yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
It is.

Andy & Chris:
oh yeah, live events.

Suzy Rowlands:
I just, you know, I don’t want to go unless I’m somewhere really close to the front. So,

Andy & Chris:
Mmm.

Suzy Rowlands:
you know, Gaynor, who helps me with events. So she

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
went to see Harry

Andy & Chris:
yeah, yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
Styles at Wembley in a box.

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
So her friend

Andy & Chris:
Oh.

Suzy Rowlands:
Anna, who works for a company called Grown Alchemist, who do beautiful. beauty products. She’s just started there. So this was some corporate thing and she said it was incredible but it does spoil you for, you know, when

Andy & Chris:
Future

Suzy Rowlands:
she was next

Andy & Chris:
events,

Suzy Rowlands:
to

Andy & Chris:
yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
David

Andy & Chris:
yeah

Suzy Rowlands:
Beckham and his lovely little daughter. So she said when she was walking back she was trying to accidentally, oh, is this not my box? Oh, I’m sorry.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, well watching Glastonbury at the weekend,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes.

Andy & Chris:
it was this weekend gone and watching the field with the pyramid stage, if

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
you’re one of the 250,000 people at the back of

Suzy Rowlands:
I know.

Andy & Chris:
the field as Elton John

Suzy Rowlands:
I know.

Andy & Chris:
was performing, I’m sure it would sound

Suzy Rowlands:
I know.

Andy & Chris:
great but you wouldn’t see much. You’d probably

Suzy Rowlands:
But

Andy & Chris:
watch

Suzy Rowlands:
you

Andy & Chris:
it

Suzy Rowlands:
can

Andy & Chris:
on your

Suzy Rowlands:
even

Andy & Chris:
iPlayer

Suzy Rowlands:
with those

Andy & Chris:
wouldn’t

Suzy Rowlands:
massive

Andy & Chris:
you? It’d probably

Suzy Rowlands:
screens,

Andy & Chris:
be better.

Suzy Rowlands:
I know, because when they did the aerial shots, I couldn’t believe how many people were

Andy & Chris:
Mmm massive

Suzy Rowlands:
packed in

Andy & Chris:
wasn’t

Suzy Rowlands:
there.

Andy & Chris:
it?

Suzy Rowlands:
It

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
was absolutely

Andy & Chris:
it was incredible

Suzy Rowlands:
astonishing. It just it just shows you. So I haven’t know. I mean, I’ve seen bits of it, but I’ve been told that I have to wait to say that Reese can watch it as well, because he really wants

Andy & Chris:
Yeah.

Suzy Rowlands:
to see Stevens as well, because he likes Kat Stevens.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah, it was very good. Well, Susie, it’s been an absolute joy. A

Suzy Rowlands:
Oh, thank

Andy & Chris:
blast. The time

Suzy Rowlands:
you.

Andy & Chris:
has flown.

Suzy Rowlands:
Thank

Andy & Chris:
It’s been

Suzy Rowlands:
you.

Andy & Chris:
so much fun. As always. And I think people are going to really enjoy understanding kind of

Suzy Rowlands:
Hahaha!

Andy & Chris:
the… No, but the kind of you as a

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
person, but also what’s gone into building the BACD

Suzy Rowlands:
What’s gone into

Andy & Chris:
as

Suzy Rowlands:
building

Andy & Chris:
well.

Suzy Rowlands:
everything.

Andy & Chris:
Yeah,

Suzy Rowlands:
Yeah,

Andy & Chris:
yeah, which is

Suzy Rowlands:
true.

Andy & Chris:
amazing. That’s brilliant. Really good. Really

Suzy Rowlands:
And

Andy & Chris:
lovely.

Suzy Rowlands:
it can

Andy & Chris:
It’s

Suzy Rowlands:
only

Andy & Chris:
wonderful.

Suzy Rowlands:
get better, can’t it? Yeah.

Andy & Chris:
Right.

Suzy Rowlands:
Okay.

Andy & Chris:
Well, we shall leave you to it. Thank you very much for your time. We’ll see you at an event very soon. Yeah, coming

Suzy Rowlands:
Yes,

Andy & Chris:
to

Suzy Rowlands:
I

Andy & Chris:
an

Suzy Rowlands:
hope

Andy & Chris:
event

Suzy Rowlands:
so.

Andy & Chris:
close. If not at Congress, but definitely before then if we

Suzy Rowlands:
before then

Andy & Chris:
can

Suzy Rowlands:
I’m

Andy & Chris:
pay

Suzy Rowlands:
sure.

Andy & Chris:
something together, which would be nice.

Suzy Rowlands:
That would be lovely.

Andy & Chris:
Lovely. Look after yourself, Suzy. Thanks for your time. Yeah, thanks very much.

Suzy Rowlands:
Bye,

Andy & Chris:
Cheers.

Suzy Rowlands:
bye, bye.